Makes me want to sing, "Gimme That Old Time Religion"

Either gets the chillin's away from the theory of "the Universe revolves around me"...but perhaps,dare I say this lest I be burned at the proverbial stake?,we might teach that "the word" is divinely inspired,not actual fact?That opens up a world of possibilities..

So your argument is that because one theory has been proven right.  Then all theories must be right.  And all allegorical language should be interpreted literally.  And thirdly one must never question anyone who calls himself a scientest?  Wow, those are three big jumps in reasoning.  I assume you have a logical, deductive rational behind these two enormous assumptions?  Do they teach reasoning like this in scientology?

No, Brother Wayfarer, no!

Tell me you have not fallen to the evils of scientisticals!  I cannot believe mine own eyes that you, too, doubt the plain words of the Good Book!  Dost it not sayeth plain in Joshua 10:12-14 

“Then spoke Joshua to the Lord in the day when the Lord gave the Amorites over to the men of Israel; and he said in the sight of Israel, ‘Sun, stand thou still at Gibeon, and thou Moon in the valley of Aijalon.’  And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the nation took vengeance on their enemies.  Is this not written in the Book of Jashar?  The sun stayed in the midst of heaven, and did not hasten to go down for about a whole day.  There has been no day like it before or since, when the Lord hearkened to the voice of a man; for the Lord fought for Israel.”

Dost thou denieth it?  This is no mere allegory, no fable, no poetic turn of words, it is historical fact directly from the Bible itself!!!  Why must I remind even you that sage Augustine wrote in the Tractates: 

"Who else save Joshua the son of Nun divided the stream of the Jordan for the people to pass over, and by the utterance of a prayer to God bridled and stopped the revolving sun? Who save Samson ever quenched his thirst with water flowing forth from the jawbone of a dead ass? Who save Elias was carried aloft in a chariot of fire (1)?

Why, oh why, do you doubt the argumentations of good Cardinal Bellarmine which clearly lay out the case against the heresies you so readily embrace?  The Holy Father himself, Pope Urban VIII, decreed in condemnation of the scientisticalist Galileo Galilei on June 22, 1633 that:

“We say, pronounce, sentence and declare that you, the said Galileo...have rendered yourself in the judgment of this Holy office vehemently suspected of heresy, namely, of having believed and held the doctrine which is false and contrary to the Sacred and Divine Scriptures, that the sun is the center of the world and does not move from east to west and that the earth moves and is not the center of the world...after it has been declared and defined as contrary to Holy Scripture...From which we are content that you be absolved, provided that...you abjure, curse, and detest before us the aforesaid errors and heresies and every other error and heresy contrary to the Catholic and Apostolic Roman Church (2).”

I fear for your holy soul, Brother Wayfarer, for if you will deny this truth, stated many times so plainly and forthrightly in the Holy Book, and defended for millenia by scholars and Holy Men who speak with God about such matters, what Biblical Truths will you NOT deny?

(1) Augustine, Tractates, XCI, Ch XV, 24-25, 2

(2) http://www.law.umkc.edu/fac...

First that doesn't change the fact that your original post consisted of some of the sorriest arguments I have ever seen and the sun stopping in it's tracts won't change that.  Which brings another question is the level of logic and reasoning that is being taught in public schools by secularist teachers?  Two remember God created the universe from nothing and set the stars and planets in their tracks.  If He wants to make the sun to stand still in the sky.  Who am I to stop Him or question how He did it.  Or can you prove that He couldn't?

Hey, Where's Pax? He was always a great champion of the Fatima miracle. You know, the one where the sun comes out of the sky and buzzes the folks in Spain. Perfectly believable. Scientists have not yet been able to prove it didn't happen.

tee hee 

Pillars!  What is this theological nonsense?  It's "turtles *ALL* the way down!"

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No, Buffoo.  Is that the logic they teach in churches nowadays?  Because one theory has been proven right, all theories must stand on their own against testing.  The theory of gravity, the theory of atoms, and the theory of evolution have all survived such tests.

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But because one book written thousands of years ago by goatherders has been proven to be non-infallible, it remains, as a whole, non-infallible.  And the more unbelievable its claims (miraculous sun-motions, walking on water, resurrection) the more doubt is in order.

I fear, Brother Wayfarer, that you err grievously...

I think you meant "the sun stopping in its tracks won't change that"  TRACKS?!?!  Yahweh didn't put the Sun and stars on no TRACKS!  The Good Book does not speak, not one time, about no trains or tracks that they ride on.  That's just plain nuts! 

But I get ya!  You do believe that the Earth is at the center and the Sun and stars in the heavens ride on tracks around and around!  Whew!  It sure looked in that first post of yours like you believed the Copernicanist lie that the Earth is the one on the track going zippityzoom around the Sun!  Pray forgive me for doubting your faith, Brother!  I knew you were one of us 24% of Americans that knows the truth of the Bible:  the Earth is fixed and unmovable and the Sun and stars revolve around it!

I hear ya about God stopping the Sun in the "tracks" its on as it goes around the Earth if she wants to.  She only wills the Sun and Moon to stop and they do. I don't even hear the mocking scientisticals with their words about how everything on Earth, including the oceans and air would instantly be hurled into empty space as the Earth suddenly stopped rotating on its axis at 1,000 mph or about the tidal forces which would rip through the planet's crust as the Moon suddenly stopped revolving around the Earth at 2,200 mph.  I don't hear them because, like you, I BELIEVE.  I believe that she can juggle all those trillions upon trillions upon trillions of gravitational and electromagnetic interactions to make it seem just like nothing happened all day except the Sun and Moon standing still in the sky.  Praise her, for she is truly great!

You have not directly answered my question, however, Brother Wayfarer.  If one did disbelieve the plain words of the Good Book about the Earth being fixed and unmoving, like that Galileo heretic did, why doesn't that set one on tracks which inevitably lead to doubting anything and everything in it?  Join me in the holy battle against the infernal lies of the scientisticals.  It is, I pray, not too late.  Let our spirits enforce the will of the venerable Pope Alexander VII in his 1665 revisions to his Bull, the Speculatores Dominus Israel, wherein he banned  

"all books and any booklets, periodicals, compositions, consultations, letters, glosses, opuscula, speeches, replies, treatises, whether printed or in manuscript, containing and treating the following subjects or about the following subjects…the mobility of the earth and the immobility of the sun."

I fear it is past time to merely teacher the controversy, it is time to put an end to it!

And you refuse to address the errors of your original post.  Plus in your desperation you are now using the old atheist tactic of humor, instead of responding seriously to a serious dialog.  If you continue to follow true to form you will soon just start launching personal attacks.  Please prove me wrong and do something original.

"you are now using the old atheist tactic of humor"

you crack me up, Wayfarer...

"the old atheist tactic of humor"

Those frikkin evil atheists and their devilish use of that old trick of theirs, the ability to make people laugh!  DAMN THEM!

Yeah, first they say we're angry, then they accuse us of using humor. If only we had become unconscious objectors to science after junior high like buffojournerwafer7, what happiness we would know without our senses of humor. 

There is a flat earth society that subscribes the earth is flat as a biblical truth: Satan took Jesus to a moutain top and "showed him the whole world" and said, "it's yours if you worship me."  The logic goes the whole world couldn't be seen unless the world is flat. Are these believers correct? Is the world flat?

Whats so strange about the flat earth society.  Their are atheist who worship their mere selves, dare to think that they should dictate how world should be run to everyone else.  So which would be the worst tragedy?  How will the poor deluded laugh, when the devil comes to claim his due and show them who their real master is?

What's so strange about the FES?  It's a joke.  And one Buffoo fell for.  Speaking of pathetic grand comedy...

Learning, one of Buffoo's multiple personalities regularly posts using that "old atheist tactic."  Perhaps at least one of him has stayed up all night wondering where the sun went, and then it finally dawned on him...

I suspected Learning's post is a put-on; you know, pressing buttons for amusement, because the logic is so darn stupid. But then, this is Bakersfield. Compared to some I've met, Learning is sane.

It sayeth in The Book of Jashar:

"Them as useth humors is damned.  Them as useth ironies is doubly damned.  Them as useth satires is triply damned.  Them as useth mockeries is quadruply damned.  Them as useth them all is ultra-super-mega damned damned damned."

You can conclude from the righteousness of my being that thus I would never commit a "put on".  And certainly not for the frivolous purposes of "amusement."

There ain't nuthin at all ha-ha-ha about the National Science Foundation survey from 2006 reporting that 1 in 4 Americans believes the Sun revolves around the Earth.  That means about 75 million of us Americans believe what the Good Book plainly states and don't buy the scientisticalist lie.  Check it out yerself at:

http://www.nsf.gov/statisti...

That there same study reports that 44%, that's almost 1/2 of all Americans, didn't  know  that it takes 1 year for the Earth to complete an orbit around the Sun.  Well no kiddin!!!  They saw the trick in that there question:  the Sun goes around the Earth in 1 day, the Earth doesn't go around the Sun at all!!!

Teacher the controversy!

And thus saith the Lord thy God:  "You guys took that Genesis stuff seriously?  With the apple and all?  Verily, thou art gullible."

I always felt I had no "scientist" in me,and that is true still...but the sun revolve around the earth?...move over lab boys.I have the "right stuff".

  " Who is this that darkens councel by words without knowledge?   

   "Now gird up your loins like a man, and I will ask you, and you instuct me!"

  "Where were you when I laid the foundations of the earth?   Tell me if you have understanding. Who set it's measurements?  Since you know."  Job  38:2-5

 "Now gird up your loins like a man, and I will ask you, and you instuct me!"

Uh, no thanks. You seem like a nice fellow, but I'm not into that lifestyle...

  Aw Rob ,and I thought were cute.  Well  - I guess it was the car.

If people want to instuct each other in the privacy of their own homes, ok by me.

Unfortunately this is typical of the type of person who brands themselves "practical, pragmatic, atheist."  They make a big noise about how scientific and rational they are.  How much smarter they are than everyone else and how the rest of mankind is nothing ,but sheep denying them their rightful place on top of the evolutionary food chain.  But then when you actually apply critical thinking to their grand proclamations; they break down into emotional hysterics.  This has been the experience of my friends and I.  On the bright side, by the grace of God; such people do get over this unnatural pride coupled with low self esteem and start on the road to psychological and spiritual healing.  This to I know from experience ,because I went through such a spot myself as a teenager and I have been blessed to meet many other former atheist who are now wholesome, well adjusted Christians. 

I hears ya DCS217!!!

Ain't weren't none of us there when she laid those foundationals and set them there pillars in those foundationals and then set the Earth right on top of them pillars to sit there evermore, fixed with an "f" and unmoving with a "u".  Ain't no scientistical gonna tell us NUTHIN' about that since they weren't there neither when Yahweh did that stuff!

So why do them know-it-all brainiacs get to teacher our babies that the Earth is revolvin around the sun and rotatin around an axis and suspended in thin air?  She couldn't a said it any plainer than she did in Psalm 19:5-6 

“In them he has set a tent for the sun, which comes forth like a bridgegroom leaving his chamber, and like a strong man runs its course with joy.  Its rising is from the end of the heavens, and its circuit to the end of them; and there is nothing hid from its heat.”

And let us pray that those words of the Lord which you trot forth are applied only to the scientisticals and not also to those of us bathing in the Light.  Ain't none of the Fathers were there neither when she Created All, but thank goodness that ain't stopped none of them from proclaiming the Truth!!!  For the Fathers of the Church have preached the plain words of the Good Book  for millenia.  Not just them Cardinals and Popes and Saints but all them Fathers have proclaimed like the sainted Gregory of Nyssa in On the Soul and Resurrection :

"..the vault of heaven prolongs itself so uninterruptedly that it encircles all things with itself, and that the earth and its surroundings are poised in the middle, and that the motion of all the revolving bodies is round this fixed and solid center...”

And you imperil your immortal soul if you dare apply them words from Job to the Fathers.   No less a Holy than Pope Leo XIII warned you fair and square in his Providentissimus Deus:

“the Holy Fathers, We say, are of supreme authority, whenever they all interpret in one and the same manner any text of the Bible, as pertaining to the doctrine of faith or morals; for their unanimity clearly evinces that such interpretation has come down from the Apostles as a matter of Catholic faith.”

And, well, you is just mixed up if you think them phrases from Job are tellin US to shut up, cause they surely ain't!!!  How we gonna get em to teacher the controversy unless we show 'em there IS a controversy!   DCS217, I beseech thee to educalate yourself on this issue.   Here is a books by a bonafided PhD and in Theology, no less, the best and only true PhD, that you should read.  It is called Galileo was Wrong and them books proves it all: http://catholicintl.com/pro... .

So no more of that there Job-like wishy-washiness DCS217!!!  Help me to get them to Teacher the Controversy!

   Learning    Wow!  - -   "Ever learning,  but never understanding."   "The fear of the Lord is the BEGINNING of wisdom." 

Job's a wonderful book.  It's the one that bats clean-up in the Old Testament, as it were.  When someone questions a particular bit of nonsense in any other book, that's the one the preacher always brings up to say, "Oh yeah?  You doubt that God is omnipotent, infallible, and always open on weekends?  Sez you!"  Or something like that. 

(It's also the book which exposes God's* true motivations, which are much like the mean little kid with the magnifying glass at the anthill.  And he's way up there, and you're way down here, whatcha gonna do about it?)

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Learning, you might look at Acts 1:11, which was used to great effect against Galileo and his followers because of the unfortunate Vulgate Latin wording:  Qui et dixerunt viri galilaei quid statis aspicientes in caelum...

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*Obviously, folks like Buffoo whose neurons are connected in a great big circle will point out that I am in the above passage discussing "God" as if She were a person who actually exists.   I can also discourse on unicorns at length without actually believing in them.  As I always thought, "a man's speech should exceed his grasp, or what's a meta phor?"

dcs, I thought we'd established that already.  The Bible writer was mistaken when he claimed there were "foundations."  It was a rush FEMA job.

Preach it, Brother Wayfarer, Preach it!

I knew them scientisticals were tryin to eat our babies!  Ever since seeing that documentary what had Charlton Heston in it called Soylent Green, I been tellin everyone I meets that "Soylent green is... PEOPLE!  It's PEOPLE, ya'll!  I seen Moses tell it!"  You state it plain:  they think we're "denying them their rightful place on top of the evolutionary food chain".  Evil scientisticals trying to snack on our children and oldsters is WRONG, no matter how smart they think they is!

And how right you is, Brother Wayfarer,  them scientisticals gets all crazy when we tells them the simple Truth of the Good Book, that it's the Sun that revolves around the Earth!  DUHHH!  They starts to pulls out their hair when we tells them that!  You said it Brother: "But then when you actually apply critical thinking to their grand proclamations; they break down into emotional hysterics".  Hysterical baby-snackers!

And then you write with righteousness "This has been the experience of my friends and I".  Not just you and your imaginary magical friends, Brother Wayfarer, not just you!  We all knows how crazy them atheisticals are.  Them 93% of the National Academy of Sciences who don't believe, that William Gates and Warren Buffett and Mark Twain and Alan Greenspan and Frank Lloyd Wright... all them hysterical nutcase unbelievers!  That's been all our experience, Brother Wayfarer!

Brother Wayfarer. we love how you call names with righteous fervor like any true Christian must!  You call them with "unnatural pride" and you call them with "low self esteem" and you call them in need of "psychological and spiritual healing" in addition to calling them "emotionally hysterical" and calling them "irrational".   And nots to forget you calling them as the cannibals they are trying to be!  Oh and in previous comments you called them out for use of that nefarious tool of Satan... HUMOR!

Let us pray that them there scientisticals can, with Gods blessing, become "well-adjusted Christians."  Then we won't even need to teacher the controversy because there won't be no controversy!

   The Bible writer never makes mistakes.  I'm so glad about that.   That Job scripture really gets to you guys. Cuts like a double edged sword!

  I'll tell you one thing ever learning, you are one fast typer!

Buffojournerwafer7 quite often condemns name-calling, just before or just after engaging in it. When it comes to hypocrisy, nobody can top him. 

No, DCS217, no!

Puts you down that "double edged sword" right quick!  Them double-edged swords is as likely to cuts you as they is to cuts them evil atheisticals!  You gots to start swingin them single-edged swords!

I likes them Katanas.  Cut clean and sharp, every time!  But you gots to gets lots of practice in your swordsmanship first, or you likely to hurt yerrself more than the other guy...

   Actually I'm a Scottsman  -- David Stewart  --  I prefer a Claymore  -- take out the whole lot of you unbelieving rascals in one sweep!

Those wielding the double-edged sword of Job often wind up like the proverbial Emperor's Executioner, who failed to kill his intended victim because in his flashy swings he inadvertently passed the razor-sharp blade through his own neck before striking the prisoner.  Only after the condemned failed to fall over did he recognize his failure, grasping his topknot to place his own head before the emperor as an expiatory sacrifice.

By the way, I should credit Brother Ambrose...couldn't find the attribution before, here is the original parable of which mine is a pale palimpsest:

SCIMETAR, n. A curved sword of exceeding keenness, in the conduct of which certain Orientals attain a surprising proficiency, as the incident here related will serve to show. The account is translated from the Japanese by Shusi Itama, a famous writer of the thirteenth century.

When the great Gichi-Kuktai was Mikado he condemned to decapitation Jijiji Ri, a high officer of the Court. Soon after the hour appointed for performance of the rite what was his Majesty's surprise to see calmly approaching the throne the man who should have been at that time ten minutes dead!

"Seventeen hundred impossible dragons!" shouted the enraged monarch. "Did I not sentence you to stand in the market-place and have your head struck off by the public executioner at three o'clock? And is it not now 3:10?"

"Son of a thousand illustrious deities," answered the condemned minister,"all that you say is so true that the truth is a lie in comparison. But your heavenly Majesty's sunny and vitalizing wishes have been pestilently disregarded. With joy I ran and placed my unworthy body in the market-place. The executioner appeared with his bare scimetar, ostentatiously whirled it in air, and then, tapping me lightly upon the neck, strode away, pelted by the populace, with whom I was ever a favorite. I am come to pray for justice upon his own dishonorable and treasonous head."

"To what regiment of executioners does the black-boweled caitiff belong?" asked the Mikado.

"To the gallant Ninety-eight Hundred and Thirty-seventh—I know the man. His name is Sakko-Samshi."

"Let him be brought before me," said the Mikado to an attendant, and a half-hour later the culprit stood in the Presence.

"Thou bastard son of a three-legged hunchback without thumbs!" roared the sovereign—"why didst thou but lightly tap the neck that it should have been thy pleasure to sever?"

"Lord of Cranes of Cherry Blooms," replied the executioner, unmoved,"command him to blow his nose with his fingers." Being commanded, Jijiji Ri laid hold of his nose and trumpeted like an elephant, all expecting to see the severed head flung violently from him. Nothing occurred: the performance prospered peacefully to the close, without incident.

All eyes were now turned on the executioner, who had grown as white as the snows on the summit of Fujiama. His legs trembled and his breath came in gasps of terror.

"Several kinds of spike-tailed brass lions!" he cried; "I am a ruined and disgraced swordsman! I struck the villain feebly because in flourishing the scimetar I had accidentally passed it through my own neck! Father of the Moon, I resign my office."

So saying, he gasped his top-knot, lifted off his head, and advancing to the throne laid it humbly at the Mikado's feet.

"I am a ruined and disgraced swordsman!""Thou bastard son of a three-legged hunchback without thumbs!"

Poetry to rival the Song of Solomon, it is.

   Wayfarer   --   The flat earth society is pretty cool but they don't have a day named after them like the athiests.  April 1st.

      "The fool has said in his heart, "There is no God"

Thank God we get one day!

Although, I usually celebrate Easter on April 1st.

    Rob  ---    That's good.  Thats when the goddess estar should be celebrated. 

  Resurrection Day however  ...

Dcs:  Matthew 5:22. 

Randomfactor, the perfidy of quoting Matthew 5:22!

Every time I reads Matthew 5:22 I wonder, similar to Job,

"Why, Lord, why?  Surely thou hast forsaken us by putting them there words in the mouth of Matthew!" 

I even wonders if maybe Matthew hisself weren't no agent of Satan.  For him to say:

"But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to his brother, 'Raca,' is answerable to the Sanhedrin. But anyone who says, 'You fool!' will be in danger of the fire of hell."

With them awful words Matthew condems us God-Fearing folk never to insult the atheisticals and scientisticals with "You fool!" on the peril of our immortal souls!  But them, they don't cares at all about calling us "You fool!" all the day long cause they don''t believes in hell anyway. 

I knows that if I were an atheistical like you, I'd be yelling "You fool!" at the tops of my lungs all day every day.  But I can't does that unless I wants to burn in them hell-fires.  And the good Lord knows I don't. 

Estar

aka: Ishtar

  Random   - I baited you. I knew  you'd jump on that. That's why  I was careful to quote the Lord. He said it, NOT ME.

  Psalms 53:1  ---  "The fool has said  in his heart, "There is no God."  They are corrupt, and have committed abominable injustice;  there is no one who does good."

       Claymore  --swoosh

   Romans 1:20 --- " For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are  WITHOUT  EXCUSE."

   Rob   ---  I think Ishtar is drooling.  I think it's a sign!

I'll see your Psalms 53:1, your Romans 1:20 and raise you a Malachi 2:3 --- "Behold, I will corrupt your seed, and spread dung upon your faces, even the dung of your solemn feasts; and one shall take you away with it."

Atom bomb --kaboom

  " in danger "  ----     it's about a heart condition.

Glad you disagree with the lord on that one, dg.  Far be it from you to quote things you don't agree with without saying so.

Note the logic employed--the psalmist speaks of an unspecified "fool," long dead and forgotten.  The wise man also hath said in his heart, "hey, this religious claptrap doesn't make any *SENSE*."

Regarding those "heart conditions," apparently the Egyptian diet was cholesterol-rich.  "Pharoah's heart was hardened..."