I don't know much about charter schools, but I love the ambition and initiative that I read about in this article.  Something has to be done to improve education, and if this is it...then great!

Yes I was reading the article in today's paper and I really like this idea,

I hope this charter school opens. A smaller campus would be good for keeping track of the students.  HIgh risk students need as much help as possible and if their parents are willing to drive them extra miles to take them to a school then they should be allowed to attend that charter school.

I'm not a fan of vouchers for private school, but I am a strong supporter of parents' right to choose the public school for their child(ren) to attend.

I agree, hotand foggy.  I wish that parent couldchoose which public school their child could attend.  I think it's unfair to reuire to go to a certain school just because they live in a certain area.  I also believe this would give school a chance to focus on their strengths (Vocational, Fine Arts, Sports, Journalism, etc.) and market themselves to students accordingly.  I don't think schools can be everything to everybody.

I'm not a fan of vouchers for private school, but I am a strong supporter of parents' right to choose the public school for their child(ren) to attend.

Why? How is it really any different?

 I think it's unfair to reuire to go to a certain school just because they live in a certain area.

Why? Wouldn't you consider transportation issues to be of consideration?

I do not care about any form of charter schools, nothing will ever change the state of our nation until all parents stand up for their children and actually HELP THEM succeed, our society has lost its first love, RESPONSIBILITY.

 Why? Wouldn't you consider transportation issues to be of consideration?

Because all schools are not created equal.  North, South, and BHS have JROTC programs.  BHS is a jock school that does a good job of preparing future college student athletes for the NCAA student clearinghouse.  Frontier and Centennial have great Marching Band programs.  West, BHS, Stockdale, and South have Project B.E.S.T..  Each school has its own programs to offer.  Why be denied those programs because you live in a certain district?

Transportation is a valid issue but if the parent can provide the transportation why be denied a program that tax dollars are providing to students?  Not every kid is going to go through College Prep and go to college.  Let's get them to graduate and maybe find their way in the process.  BC is currently doing the job that high schools can do.  There is too much redundancy in the education system because of this districting scheme.

Among Smothers' charter plans: a rigorous curriculum, small class sizes and intensive intervention programs to pull up low-performing students. Many schools already use these techniques. Differences include an 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. school day, a signed student contract and required parental participation "at every PTA" board meeting, said Smothers, a child psychologist.

Why can't public schools do this????

Students would do community work. A strategic curriculum design would prioritize standards for students, and Smothers expects a school culture that would lead to college.

Why can't public schools do this????

Smothers, who attended McDonald #35, an all-black, college-prep public school in New Orleans, where the attitude was everyone went to college.

Still haven't figured out college is not for everybody...............Now there are no jobs for college grads, but they can still get a job at McDonald's.

He said a school needed to reach out to parents who weren't involved enough and help them understand "what they can do" for their low-achieving students.

Why can't public schools do this???? Why, specifically, are these kids "low achieving"?? Please don't give the "poverty card" - many were poor when I was growing up, many had parents who didn't give a damn, the difference was the teachers, THEY gave a damn and THEY helped out the poor, parent does give a damn low achieving student - black-white-brown-red, etc

the charter would offer more cultural and political awareness for black children, and give them a sense of purpose to make a difference in the world.

Why can't public schools do this????

Why just black children? possibly hispanic children?

Wasn't too many years ago there were black schools and white schools - and Martin Luther King and others fought to get the black kids into the white schools, which I had/have no problem with.  Now they want to go back to black/hispanic schools.

I'll now wait for the backlash of "you're racist"; you don't understand; you're racist....................

Not every Black person agrees with everything MLK said.  As a black person, I don't agree with everything he said.  He had detractors in his own time (Malcom X, for one).  I didn't live in those times but I don't know if I could adhere to the whole non-violence thing.  I would have been a native born terrorist.

Black kids are failing out of school at an alarming rate.  There is a need for mentorship of young Black students to succeed.  What's the problem.  I doubt he would flat out reject a kid for being White.

What are Black people supposed to do to heal their community.  Are they just supposed to wait for somone else to care or address the issue (Another issue I disagree with MLK)?

as a teacher, Jfrancais, about 20% of my population is black.   From what i see, and hear from my students, there arent enough black role models in the community.....we have no black teachers...heck we have no blacks in any position at the school i work at.

I think you're right Learnem.  It's a big problem.  I was actually recruited to be a (Black) teacher in KC.  I considered but I didn't have the desire to put in that much effort to get a bachelor's degree to become a teacher when I could go to school for the same amount of time and have a Master's Degree in my passion (International Relations).

The role models they have are questionable (Wesley Crawford, Vincent Brothers, etc.).  I hat eto harp on that case because it hurts me personally but aside from that they guy was all over the place galavanting with women and engaging in questionable behavior.  I really looked up to that guy ( I still do) but there is slim pickings in KC.

I have a buddy who is the Asst. Principal at Casa Loma.  We were both in a program to recruit Black teachers but I think the program was a joke.  The few Black Educators in administration (Ethel Dixon, Fuschia Ward) I do not look upon favorably when it comes to Black mentorship and use of grants/funds.  I think their priorities are elsewhere.

I totally disagree that Charter Schools, or vouchers, or SCHOOL CHOICE for that matter are the answer. The premise is we curve dropout rates by giving parents choices. Most of these parents aren't going to get involved anyways (truth be told). What results is just another school that the parents that actually care could send their kids to, while the kids with uninvolved parents continue to attend the 'substandard' school. All that providing choices will do is widen the education gap between the haves and have nots.  Race is not so much a factor in education anymore as it is POVERTY. Look at Oildale for instance. I don't think anyone would consider those kids, in general, as priviledged.     Culturally, these are populations that do not value education. The only hope for these kids is stronger PUBLIC schools.  Choice will lead to mass exodust out of schools that are already hurting since they are paid by the state based on attendance. So the answer to fixing education is to STARVE struggling schools of students? I don't think so. I hope the Greenfield School District denies the application. Keep the focus on FIXING what we have.  Don't further contribute to the divisions that already exist between  schools and school districts.

We will never have a strong public school system until we EQUALLY distribute public money to all schools. 

i know a guy, Stanley Ennis...one of the best teachers I know.  he works for BCSD.  he is a great role model for the black community. 

i agree with you on the X and brothers... not real great role models...they had their own agenda

patrick...i agree with you MOSTLY...

charter schools may or may not work...it depends on the parents.  but doesnt every public school?  I grew up in Oildale, my parents werent educated, but they made damn sure my brother and I were...i remember nights sitting at the table with my dad while he was trying to figure out how to do the math I had for homework FROM THE 5TH GRADE.  

i remember that, and now do it with my own kids.  PARENTS are the primary educator.  No amount of afterschool programs, tutors, freebies, and mentors can make up for an educationally absent parent.

the poverty part is right, thats for sure...all you have to do is look at the CST scores posted in the paper every year, look for the lowest scores, then look those schools up on the map....gee where are they?  the ghetto...every single time.

I'd be against school choice if every school had a good fine arts, athletic, vocational, etc.  Each school can't be everything to everyone.  Why expend resources in that manner?  Why be "forced" to go to a substandard school? 

Race is not so much a factor in education anymore as it is POVERTY.

Race is not much of a factor in many of America's social problems as it is poverty.  If anything, the race issue divides the poor into opposing factions.

So the answer to fixing education is to STARVE struggling schools of students?

Yes.  Or find your "niche".  Be a jock school.  Be a magnet school.  Be a vocational school.  Do what you are good at and quit spending money to be a cookie cutter school.  Every child is not/should not be in college prep. 

Why not have a school that can offer classes to give kids HAZMAT certifications?  CDLs?  ARC Welding? Plumbing? Electrical? Construction Management?  Why not teach some kids agricultural sciences?  These are "shovel ready" jobs in KC. 

We will never have a strong public school system until we EQUALLY distribute public money to all schools.

something else we agree on.  How sad is it that when a student gets suspended for any reason at all, they still come to school, but sit in an isolated classroom, instead of being a burden on their parents?

because schools get money based on attendance, the school must make every student count, so the family doesnt really have to deal with the fact that jr misbehaved at school, and now has to stay home for a few days because of his behavior.

We will never have a strong public school system until we EQUALLY distribute public money to all schools. 

That might change my view on school choice.  All schools are not created equal.  Separate but equal schools exists today.

  Again, it's not about race, it's about poverty.  Clovis has the best school district in the valley.
 

I don't think South High gets the same amount of money as Frontier. If I am wrong, I would like to become more educated in the way that property tax money is spent.

school districts are allocated money on student attendance...im not sure how KHSD doles out its funds to its schools, but the district gets paid by the number of students in their seats each day

Thanks learn

Schools are paid the same way in KHSD, I believe: attendance. That is why school choice is a HORRIBLE idea!  Also keep in mind that a lot of the differences we see between the 'good schools' and 'bad schools' has nothing to do with how much money they get from the government, but outside money such as grants and private donations. Schools have to do a better job recruiting support from its community-another reason why school choice is a BAD idea. It drains school districts of its most valuable resource: families.  Schools are able to purchase equipment, uniforms, technology, based often on the generosity of parents, families, and community businesses. Its a given that schools in richer areas will have more 'stuff' at their disposal. For example, try paying a visit to Foothill HS-then visit Stockdale HS. The differences are STRIKING!  Schools in more impoverished areas have to work harder to provide kids with anything beyond the basics provided by the state. Parental involvement then becomes crucial. I am proud to say that my son attends one of these schools in a poorer area: Voorhies Elementary in SE Bakersfield. Dr Gayles has done an excellent job mobilizing and DEMANDING parent involvement. As a result, the school's AGI is an impressive 763! Almost 100 points above the district average! Fixing public schools IS possible. I'd rather parents be given some stake in their NEIGHBORHOOD SCHOOL  rather than giving them a choice to go school shopping.  School shopping will only go to hurt the students who are most at risk. The parents that would care enough to demand quality education for their children are NOT the ones that need the help. Those kids will succeed no matter where they go to school, because the parents will DEMAND that kid perform.

  For example, try paying a visit to Foothill HS-then visit Stockdale HS. The differences are STRIKING! 

That's why I say let the impoverished kids have access to those resources at Stockdale.

 Also keep in mind that a lot of the differences we see between the 'good schools' and 'bad schools' has nothing to do with how much money they get from the government, but outside money such as grants and private donations.

That's a good point but also a sad commentary that schools have to go to corporations and ask for money.  Makes me think that having the poor performing school hire a professional grant writer would not be a bad idea.  We are asking educators/administrators to be fundraiser while prepping the kids for the standardized test.  Do they teach these skills in college when becoming a teacher/administrator?

What's going to happen when the fire station or military has to ask corporations for a grant for day to day ops?  Will we ever have bake sales to buy really cool tanks and missiles?

POGO: We will never have a strong public school system until we EQUALLY distribute public money to all schools.

Have been saying that for years POGO.  Take in all the school tax money, distribute it equally and demand an accurate accountung from the schools - yes, I know they do but I have seen how it can be "fudged".

LEARNEM:  lowest scores, then look those schools up on the map....gee where are they?  the ghetto...every single time.

Why is that?? Why do the "ghetto" schools have lower scores? students? teachers? parents? administration?  ???????? all of the above? Then maybe the district admin folks need to get off their arse and look into it eh?

JFRANCIS:  Why not have a school that can offer classes to give kids HAZMAT certifications?  CDLs?  ARC Welding? Plumbing? Electrical? Construction Management?  Why not teach some kids agricultural sciences?  These are "shovel ready" jobs in KC.

ALL the HS's USED to have school to work programs. The powers that be in their infinate wisdome (HA) decided to "phase" out those programs citing "cost" so they could buy all the computers and techies and such so "everybody could go to college". big mistake. Now trying to re-implement these programs will cost bazzilions and of course try to find a teacher who could/would teach these programs - everybody's on the computer/to college trak. My husband, HS grad, could teach auto mechanics to anybody who would stand still long enough but he has no 'degree' so not considered 'teacher' material. IMO hiring people within a specific industry (degree or not) to teach shop classes would be more understandable then hiring somebody with an English degree to teach those classes - and yes they do that.

the thing about allowing universal access is this

a kid goes to foothill.  he wants to go to stockdale.....parents already dont bother helping him with his homework...they dont participate academically in his life.

so now, instead of going to a school that is less than 2 miles away, and he can walk, he has to take a bus clear across town, and be up a full 2 hours earlier just to catch it on time.

If he has problems at school, and wants to stay after school for some extra help...he can't because he will miss his bus that has to take him clear back on the other side of town.

the role that the parents play in a child's education is a dominant one, and usually dictates how the child will do in school

and we all know, how you do in school is how you do in life.

I'll stand by my contention that a student that cares to succeed will succeed no matter where he or she goes to school.  Creating a system where every parent could choose where to send their kid will result in GREATER achievment gaps. A compromise may be to give parents more stake in school decisions. If parents decide they want an JROTC (great program by the way), let administration work on bringing one in. Schools should recognize that if they expect parent participation, they should allow for parent imput.

Kids should go to the school that is the closest to them. Over crowding? bring in more buildings/teachers.

There were no less then 30 in our classrooms and we ALL learned. Things were tougher then for the minorities but they made it - they graduated and may not have gone to college but they learned a trade at the HS level and were able to go out and make a living. I, myself, took all the secretarial classes and graduated at age 17. I did go to BC for 3 semesters but didn't much like it - I was bored. So, I quit (age 18) and got a job as a bank managers secretary. Had I not had the HS training who knows where I would have ended up.  The HS's need to go back to that era - like it or not.

IMO, setting up special charter classes for minorities/poor will only exacerbate the racial/socioeconomic lines that are already drawn in the sand and cause more problems. Take the charter school ideas and curriculum to the main stream HS's and make it work.

They have open enrollment periods for high schools in Bakersfield. People can apply to go to any high school regardless of where they live. Younger children can also be granted transfers to schools outside of their boundaries if their daytime caretakers are closer to another school, so there is some semblance of choice out there.

There are kids that lose in the lotteries (i.e. get put on the waiting list).  It is a good idea nonetheless.  It allows kids to go to a school outside the district.

Witters, you're right about vocational programs existing in the district.  They drank the techie kool-aid but the realities is is that computers got integrated into everything.  You didn't have to be a computer engineer major to work with computers.  Fast food and oilfield workers use computers on some level.  Even mechanics.  The district in its infinite wisdom failed to see the integration and just saw it as a case of computers taking away jobs.

Jfrancais, I'm copying this exchange here only for the sake of clarity:

 Why? Wouldn't you consider transportation issues to be of consideration?

Because all schools are not created equal.  North, South, and BHS have JROTC programs.  BHS is a jock school that does a good job of preparing future college student athletes for the NCAA student clearinghouse.  Frontier and Centennial have great Marching Band programs.  West, BHS, Stockdale, and South have Project B.E.S.T..  Each school has its own programs to offer.  Why be denied those programs because you live in a certain district?

Transportation is a valid issue but if the parent can provide the transportation why be denied a program that tax dollars are providing to students?  Not every kid is going to go through College Prep and go to college.  Let's get them to graduate and maybe find their way in the process.  BC is currently doing the job that high schools can do.  There is too much redundancy in the education system because of this districting scheme.

My response:

I completely agree that students should have the option to choose sites that will further develop their interests; it is a regrettable fact that every campus can't offer the best of each pursuit. My 8th grade classmates from private school joined me at Highland for the GATE program as they lived in the Foothill boundary. I get it.

My comment regarding transportation is only in consideration of the enormous budget shortfalls. I have a friend who works in that department at KCSOS ... the numbers are staggering. I also know of several people who have had transportation for their "special" kids terminated. TERMINATED. Unless, of course, the parents provide TAX RETURNS to prove that they can't afford to hire it out. But that's only for the "special" kids. Sorry, I digress. 

I understand.  I think transportation is a valid concern, especially in today's hard times. 

I went to BHS even though I lived in South High district.  I took the GET bus to school or got rides from other kids that lived outside the district attending BHS.