I heard illegal fireworks "bursting in air" last night. They're getting an early start this year it seems. And I'm with you on not wanting the house to burn down, although in my neighborhood it's the illegal fireworks I worry most about. All the years I've lived here, there's always been someone within a couple of blocks, if not multiple someones, setting them off. So now every year my pre-Fourth ritual is to rake up pine needles and soak down the yard hoping if something does land here, it won't ignite. It's a tradition I could do without frankly.

I really don't care which way it goes. We have a block party every year and the kid next door sells the legal ones to support her cheerleading team, so I buy one and toss it in the "pile" with everyone elses. We BBQ, have a few beers and let the older kids light the fireworks. They all get bored quickly, and most years, there are unlit(albiet doused with water)works and duds in the trash on the 5th. We clean our messes up, but many peopole around town do not. The streets are littered with used works the next day and the air is a mess for two days. Yeah..it IS kind of a pain and efinitely dangerous when illegal works are brought to bear.

My neighbors bro-in-law was fined $1,500 two years ago for illegal fireworks. HE learned his lesson. Many do not. Also, I know it wasn't on the 4th last year, but the Tehachapi Depot was burned to the ground as it was nearing complete restoration by two dipsticks with bottle rockets. I'll wager THEY learned their lesson.

So, if there is no backing to ban fireworks, so be it. I'm OK with that, but maybe making the fine for illegals or the illegal use of legal ones should carry say, $2,500 and $2,000 fines, respectively. Maybe it would help, maybe not, but one thing will always be certain, and that is that there are idiots out there, drunk and sober, who have no respect for the law and will always use illegal fireworks.

I seem to remember Bill McDougle, of the Bakersfield City District School Board posting a blog last year in support of a ban.  Of course, that was before his election. Correct me if I'm wrong..

I was a kid when they made cherry bombs illegal in Hawaii [Oooh nooo!]  I celebrated the Fourth and New Years with bottle rockets and black cats [ the fire cracker ] wars with my brothers in Texas that would leave us all partially deaf for a couple of months.  When I moved to California I thought that the legal fire works was a joke.  I have even been a guest at some of the block parties Moto discribes.  At this point in my life I agree we should do with out anything ,but stadium fire works [ Help me, I turned into my parents!!!! ] But that will take time to happen.  

I wonder how many of th e injuries were caused by the "Safe and Sane" fireworks and not the illegal kind.  Seems to me that prohibiting law abiding citizens from using legal fireworks isn't going to stop the purchase, importation and sale of the illegal kind.  So you're basically penalizing everyone who buys legal fireworks for the shenanigans caused the those who break the law.  Considering those people who purchase illegal fireworks are not going to stop because there is a ban of all fireworks, I wonder just how effective a ban would be at preventing the horrors described in this editorial.

I think the biggest disincentive to purchasing fireworks is their price and "bang for the buck".  Paying $50 for something that will burn and fizzle out in 10 minutes is enough to send all but the richest of the rich clutching their pocketbook in horror unless they really do like burning money. 

Alternatives I'd consider would be free public fireworks shows around the city that enable those with limited means to enjoy the nation's birFday.  Maybe the city can use the savings from fire department and police over-time to fund them.  Yeah, I doubt that's going to happen.

As for the fire hazard and air quality - well these are bad throughout the summer.  Personally, I'm going to the bay area to watch the professional fireworks over the bay and to escape the heat and pollution, but I'm sure both will still be waiting for me upon my return.

I usually celebrate the 4th on a block where a number of cops live.  The cops confiscate illegal fireworks all year long and they don't let them go to waste.

Of all the holidays we celebrate the 4th is my least favorite entertainment wise.  I hate ground fireworks with a passion.  I don't like "startle" effect of fireworks, I don't like the stink.

I love what it stands for, just not the traditions we've adopted.  I ususally go to Marks block party, contributing chili beans. and have taken to taking my leave when the kids break out the fireworks.  I do love the ariels though, and have been known to pull over itno a parking lot to see them..

Very difficult to locate the illegal fireworks with all the noise and visuals of the legal fireworks. If you want to stamp out most of the illegal fireworks I think you have to do away with the legal fireworks. I know the big bugaboo about eliminating these fire and accident hazards has been the hit that worthy non-profits would take by not being allowed to sell them. Here is a thought . Why not sell the stadium show, and some of the other big fireworks shows in town exclusively through these non profits, and allow them to take a slice for their organizations.

Nice to see such a show of consensus among the bloggers thus far, and the really thoughtful discussion.

Cool!

i wish they would ban *ALL* holidays so we wouldnt have to suffer all the negativity they incite like this blog..people hate Halloween then christmas is a bunch of bull as far as many on here feel after all its a 'christian holiday'..now i read new years..whats left memorial day ..labor day just a reason to get drunk and picnic.....opps easter another 'christian holiday' and what about thanksgivng maybe we need to start on it since theres not much left..

see what i mean somebody always has a gripe..might be better if we just forget the whole stupid holiday thing..and just let one day blend into the next...maybe then atleast everyone would be happy *RIGHT*?

My dogs would love a ban. So would I.

Hohoho!  Sioux just raised the blog snark level to 8.  Do I hear a 9?  Anyone? 

(LOL Sioux.  That was really funny.  : )

And, since I live in the county instead of the city, I would hate to ruin all my neighbors' smoky, noisy, polluting, littering fun by banning fireworks.  They're all a bunch of rugged individualists out here (building permit?  Ha!) and they often look the other way when we pull our shenanigans (so it's off by 4 feet.  So what?)

I'm against dork-lit fireworks in principle, but I understand the primal need to be barefoot and beer-laden with a lighter in your hand and a brightly-lit firehazard inches from your car. 

cat I'm against dork-lit fireworks in principle, but I understand the primal need to be barefoot and beer-laden with a lighter in your hand and a brightly-lit firehazard inches from your car. 

if there that (edit) dumb they deserve a ride to UCLA...but that was a good group of words you put together cat..

Observer has been buying dog tranquilizers.

How many of them dog tranqs have you been buy'n ?

--virgil

dang it observer i almost liked you..and thought you had something to offer the blogs..i guess i am wrong every once in awhile..

PS if you gotta tranq your dogs on the 4th ya might need to think about getting a new dog

seriously,

Catherine can put words together ... that was funny.

--virgil

I don't know ... it comes in a liquid, don't it ?

Let me call my brother,  bob.  :  )

--virgil

 OB  don't know if I can still order them without a vet's prescription.

never were able too so you were just talkin smack...tsk tsk now im losin more respect

sioux says: if there that (edit) dumb they deserve a ride to UCLA..

Shame, shame, shame on you.

We can't burn a fire in the winter because of particulate matter, but fireworks are ok and only God knows how many tons of soot we thrust into the air every 4th. Where's CARB???

And the Yenta fun police are back

Fireworks are such a waste of money!  My 5 yr old grandson puts his hands over his ears and runs in the house crying.  This year no fireworks, just a BBQ  and swimming!   in the pool.  we can watch the collage fireworks from our back yard.

You know they make the bombs from whistling petes.  a hammer and black tape!   Maybe ban those noisy things.

I'm neither for against banning fireworks.  Matters not to me.  My thing is I don't like the ground kind but I don't care if kids get them.  This year is going to be different as I can't take a lot of noise with my left ear being out of commission....some noises actually cause pain and extreme pressure.

I never have like the smell of matches (sulpher) or candles when they go out...it chokes me up..and not from sentimentality.  3 day weekend like Labor day and Memorial Day mean little to me.  As they say, being retired, you miss vacations and 3 day weekend.  It's just now starting to affect me tho...when the place I work has a 3 day holiday it means more work for me since they have to cram 6 days of work into 4 days.

Here are some fireworks you might enjoy.   Warning Nancy  turn down the sound on you computer so your ears will not suffer from the KABOOM!!!!     Click here: Fireworks

Idiots are just that: idiots. If you ban legal fireworks, then you will have more illegal fireworks. Afterall, people who really want to celebrate with a bang will still make a bang. You don't have much to worry about from people who buy only safe and sane fireworks, anyway. The idiot that would madify safe fireworks in an unsafe manner will turn to "other" explosives or to "explosive recipes" found on the internet. Or they will go out and fire guns into the air. Whatever it takes.

The vast majority of safe and sane fireworks users use them in a safe manner. Why punish them? You'd save more people and property by creating a curfew at 6PM on the fourth.

A few years ago I was against a ban on "legal" fireworks, but then my kids were younger and we all enjoyed watching the excitement in their eyes. Now after having my husband working the "call center" on the few 4th of July's that he is supposed to be off my views have changed. Two years ago I called to report illegal fireworks coming from the neighbor directly behind me, he was setting off bottle rockets. The "task force" went to check and since there was a sheriff's car there they did not do any other investigation and called it handled. The neighbor is a sheriff deputy. I found remnants of seven bottle rockets in my backyard. Wow what a role model for his kids...."see daddy is a cop so he can do what he wants even if its illegal, and get away with it."

Last year we were out in the front yard lighting the few legal fireworks we had bought, I noticed a police officer on his motorcycle visiting at a neighbors house a few houses down. We all could see illegal fireworks coming from a few streets over, the officer was at this particular house for over 3 hrs. he was in the front yard and I know he saw the same illegal fireworks we did. Either on duty or off duty, I think he should have done something.

So now I guess I have to be against a ban, since those who are supposed to uphold the law don't.

Let's perhaps try something out of the box . . . see if there is any data available from those cities/counties that allowed safe&sane or any other type of fireworks then later imposed a ban on fireworks available for sale to the public. Did it result in lower numbers in: fires started by, injuries resulting from, pollution particulates, Lbs. of fireworks confiscated by law inforcement, reports to law enforcement about: illegal fireworks, the number of non-profit organizations or proceeds raised annually as a result of a ban on fireworks. Is there data available from cities/counties that allow safe & Sane fireworks and/or those with no regulations on fireworks in other parts of the country. Do they have higher or lower numbers (per capita) in the areas of concern.

I think the problem lies in that the city and the county have different ordinances.  You can go to NE Bakersfield and buy fireworks that are not allowed in the SE.  Correct me if I am wrong.  Every year I end up making several calls to the fireworks hotline regarding illegal fireworks.  Most are coming from the apartments on N Halfmoon both east and west of Ashe Rd.  I have even gone so far as driving down the alley behind the apartments and watching the offenders scrambling.  They could give a rats butt as they live in apts that are disposable.  The surrounding area is houses, many of which still have the old shake roofs and are an extreme fire hazard.  As one blogger noted, they start prior to the 4th.  I am hoping with the economy being as it is the idiots budget will not afford fireworks. 

"The charities that relied on proceeds from fireworks sales found other ways to make money, people found other ways to celebrate"..... Lois, please give us the names of, say, three of the charities that made money selling fireworks and quit selling fireworks, and what they did to earn as much, if not more, money than they made selling fireworks.  Also, please give two or three examples of what "other people" now do to celebrate instead of using fireworks.  Thanks!

I agree with banning personal fireworks on the 4th for all of the reasons cited by Lois but more importantly for the reason Sue Benham is opposed to them, air pollution.

Lois, you rock.  I have been in favor of this for years.  I cannot understand why people have to be so irresponsible by blowing part of their neighborhood in order to celebrate a holiday.  I cringe every year when I see the fireworks stands going up a few days before.  Then I fell it is just morally wrong to have schools, boy/girl scouts, and other youth groups use it as a fund raiser (but that is just me).  If parents cannot be responsible, then what makes you think the kids will be.  It is always the few bad apples that ruin everything.  Then to make matters worse, there is no city ordinance that prevents fireworks from being set off anytime.  In other words, anyone can shoot fireworks 365 days a year if they so choose.  What is wrong with that picture?

Then, let's not forget that we are the #2 most polluted city in the US.  So why not shoot off tons of fireworks and create a dark haze of smoke throughout the city and just add to the problem.  Let's make the people who have lung conditions harder for them to breathe.  That is a great idea.  If other cities and counties in this state can ban fireworks, why can't we?  Oh, wait I know... we are in a recession so why not blow $300-400 on useless explosives that could have put food on your table or clothes on your kids.  Better yet, the sheer amount of money that is spent between July 1 and 4 could almost get this state out of debt.  Oh, but wait, that just isn't important so let's blow up the neighborhoods instead.  That's a great idea!!!  And no I am not bitter.  I just don't see the need.  I love this country but there are certainly other ways to celebrate than destroying things.

The youth group from my church used to use fireworks sales to raise money for summer programs.  They stopped selling fireworks about four years ago.  The reason was that as with other  volunteer endeavors there were just a few parents and teens doing all the work.   While the other parents only  complained about everything but still expected to reap the rewards.  The moms who were doing all of the work decided it was too much of a hassle to continue.  We do yard sales and car washes now.  We also have fund raising dinners and silent auctions.  There is a higher percentage of participation among the families and we are not cramming all of our fund raising efforts into a limited number of days during the hottest part of the year.  I do not miss my hours of working at the fireworks booth.  I was raised in a community where fireworks were not allowed.  Our air never smelled as bad as the Bakersfield air smells on the days in early July.  It was a shock to me when I moved here that fireworks were allowed.  I had spent years hearing about all those California wildfires.  I could not understand why fireworks were legal here.  It seemed risky to me. 

A relative of mine operated his group's fireworks booth for many years.  They quit a couple years ago and seem to be managing fine with other fundraisers.

With the state's financial cutbacks, this may be the year they just let California burn when the idiots set it alight this July.

Good memories are made on July 4th - with legal home fireworks on the agenda.

No depriving my kids of the fun I had as a kid.

Sawwwwy....

I just don't understand folks saying there shouldn't be a ban because folks will just go for the illegal fireworks anyway. Try using that logic on other banned substances - like drugs and automatic weapons. It just doesn't fly. The point is not to put every 'beer laden" suburbanite whose "brains have flown out their backside" (both great descriptors) on equal footing with scofflaws, the point is to tamp down the general acceptance and availability. If the city and county ban the fireworks, most folks will abide by the ban. And the problems will decrease.

That being said, I actually agree with sioxcity's snarky comment. I think Halloween is being killed for very little reason - the dangers to children being largely mythical; I think folks banning creches are going overboard (we should be welcoming menorrahs and atheist displays at the same time instead); Holidays are meant to help us mark the passing of seasons, to allow a break between periods of work.

Celebrations, if enthusiastic, are bound to involve some problems. I believe in education. We haven't tried enough of that. We have a block party on our block also, and have the folks who were buying illegals to stop and join us. It requires community building and effort on the part of a few. But it works.

Try using that logic on other banned substances - like drugs

I'll take that at face value:  those who support the right to use fireworks ought, to avoid hypocrisy, to support the private use of drugs.  But they always seems to think freedom is for them, not anyone else.

God... I hate this city and county.  It seems that everyone here wants to make sure there is NOTHING fun to do ever.  They bitch and moan and groan about new shopping centers or anything that tries to come in to town.  I just don't flippen get it.  This city is just full of a bunch of complainers.  GROW UP.  CHILL OUT.  Just because you don't like something doesn't mean you have to take it away from everyone.  WHERE DID THIS SENSE OF ENTITLEMENT COME FROM! WHO DO YOU THINK YOU ARE?! I just don't get it.

Wow, what an amazing piece of logic here. 

Some people buy illegal fireworks, some people get injured or cause property damage using illegal fireworks. Some people even act dumb and hurt themselves using legal fireworks, so let's ban them all.

Using that logic, we should ban guns, cars, food, power tools, skates, skateboards, among lots and lots of other things because some people act dumb and use them dangerously and get hurt or hurt others.

By Lois' logic, we should ban cars especially. There are people that drive drunk or irresponsibly, run red lights and cause damage to personal property, great bodily harm and death. Some of them are also disturbingly loud. We should ban them then, right?

If fireworks bother you that much, plan a vacation on the 4th of July. If you're worried about your thatch roof catching on fire, well perhaps you should think about using a more non-flamable material for your roof, or on the other hand you could replace it with dry straw.

Pete, you ignore the fact that we're actually talking about the currently-*LEGAL* type of fireworks.   Or are you arguing for the legalization of bottle-rockets and M-80's?

I have neighbors who start the fireworks days before the actual holiday and days AFTER the holiday. I wouldn't care but it scares the dogs and it freaks them out. It is a huge nuisance. Plus all the smoke it causes, like our air quality isn't bad enough. So yeah, I agree. Personal fireworks are a pain.

Well, no (I wouldn't mind though because I would use them safely). It just doesn't make sense to ban the legal ones because some people buy and use illegal ones. Unless I read that wrong, that is what Lois is proposing.

What I think she's proposing is banning the legal ones not because illegal ones exist, but because the *LEGAL* ones actually cause a greater problem (fires, air pollution, trash) than the illegal ones do.  It's a valid point, I think, which is obscured by her arguing the numbers of citations issued.

Making *ALL* private fireworks illegal would make the illegal ones easier to spot, of course. 

Hey, Random!!!  You are absolutely, positively, 100% correct, again.  I am not a hypocrite! I support the use of safe and sane fireworks on the 4th of July.  I also support the right of anyone who wants to use cocaine, methamphetamine, marijuana, PCP, etc., to use those substances------on the 4th of July only, so they can honor the founding of our country in the manner they deem most patriotic. 

I'll meet you half way. Ban them on New Year's Eve. New Year's Eve is a bigger disturbance of the peace.

I can live with that, midterm...but you should allow them the same two-week window the fireworks nuts seem to get.  It's only fair.   But in keeping with the Founding Fathers theme, maybe limit it to patriotic cannabis like George Washington grew?

"Making *ALL* private fireworks illegal would make the illegal ones easier to spot, of course."

So we should make Tylenol illegal because cocaine is illegal?

witbee, by applying Lois' logic to other things, we absolutely should ban tylenol. We should ban aspirin first though. The rate of deaths due to aspirin is frightening.

So we should make Tylenol illegal because cocaine is illegal?

No, we should make Tylenol illegal because it kills people, and cannabis legal because it doesn't. 

The rate of deaths due to aspirin is frightening.

Roughly the same as tylenol deaths, Pete.  Both pikers compared to tobacco and alcohol, of course.