So he did go or he didn't?  How can you fire someone in the military wouldn't he be discharged?  

One of my friends in Nazi Germany asked if our lives here mimicked the Planet of the Apes.  I told him yes.  The coo, er commander in chief scares me.

Now this is a real gem: 

 "if caught by enemies who may not regard the president as legitimate and thus deny him the Geneva Convention protections."

Let's see, he's worried about being captured by people that think the same way he does, and would act like the previous administration which surely he supported. Somehow this makes sense?

 So he did go or he didn't?  How can you fire someone in the military wouldn't he be discharged?

Yes, people get fired in the army everyday.  Discharge is something different.  For example, I can be "fired" as a commander but I still retain my rank and service in th emilitary.  Discharge is completely out of the army. 

Officers fall under another category.  We serve at the convenience of the President (and government).

pax: thank you for this link. it's like an encyclopedia of nutbaggery. I thoroughly enjoyed it.

The guy is a coward and publicity seeker. No different than any draftee that took refuge in Canada.
But now the right wing wackos put this bum up on a pedestal.

The right Wing has lost all sense of honor. They are bowing to the hatred that has been boiling up inside them.

The Army is not going to waste time in a civilian courtroom.  Maj. Stefan Frederick Cook
will see his day in court. But it will be a military court under military charges. His orders were lawful. He will pay the price. And I hope it is a dishonorable discharge.

Get this birther thing out of your heads. It is driving you to insanity. Just like it drove Maj. Stefan Frederick Cook to act so foolishly.

This argument has no legs. It is a dead issue.
Wake up and smell the coffee.

A privately employed person, in the Army Reserve, refused duty when called.

Then, was understandably  fired from the corporate job.

A disgrace to those who proudly serve.

After Abu Grabe, the Geneva Convention argument doesn't wash.

 By following it, he fears being treated as a criminal if caught by enemies who may not regard the president as legitimate and thus deny him the Geneva Convention protections.

One thing I like bout the army is that they know BS when the see it (smell it?)

" But now the right wing wackos put this bum up on a pedestal.

The right Wing has lost all sense of honor. They are bowing to the hatred that has been boiling up inside them."

Dang!  I sure hope I don't run into any of 'em!  Where are they hidin' out?!?
 

 The coo, er commander in chief scares me.

lame.

Since when does "the enemy" in that barbaric armpit of creation consider the Geneva Convention? You're talking about an "enemy" that murders women in market places, beheads school teachers, blows up school buses with children....but they might harm an American officer if he's captured and they question the president.....

If not for yourself, pax, for your loved ones, for your pets, get help while you can. Just tell the nice doctor you're losing it. He'll think of something to make you feel better. Trust me on this. 

Well Tutt,

You’ve been living amongst them for years. Remember just a few years ago, there was the movement to change the constitution so that Arnold could run for president.

You’d have a hard time getting anyone to admit to that tinfoil hat idea. (Is Palin the new Arnny?)

Of course there were the tinfoil hat leftists also. Remember the claim that McCain wasn’t a citizen because he was born in Panama. Never mind that he was the child of a Navy Admiral stationed in Panama.

Tinfoil hats and E-mail chain letters. Who says America isn’t a nation on the move.

For instance the tinfoil hat guys say we are going to visit foreign planets. Just in case earth would become inhospitable..

If Mars isn’t inhospitable. What is?

If we learn how to make Mars hospitable. How bad would earth have to be that we could not make life even better here on earth.

If we were to destroy earth to the point that Mars is more hospitable. How long could we possible have on Mars?

Just as it is difficult to make a sensible argument concerning living on Mars. It is difficult to continue to argue the tinhat birther.

Get over it Pax…

Guess that will teach him for assuming that his rights to free speech and due process would be honored. Any other soldiers considering such action can be ascertained that they will face a similar fate -- a summary dismissal, ridicule and no help whatsoever from the Whistleblower Protection Act -- for even daring to insult the Highly Inflated One.

Are you saying this, produced by Obama in 2008 (on demand), is also a forgery?

http://msgboard.snopes.com/...

 Also, how do you explain the birth announcement in the local, Honolulu paper printed in 1961 announcing Obama's birth?  Again, are we to believe these people were omniscient and knew that their child would be president at birth and, therefore, put this in the paper just to cover their tails more than forty years later?

"Well Tutt,

You’ve been living amongst them for years."

Son of A....!  And they all look so normal, too!  But here they are, goin' 'round  "bowing to the hatred that has been boiling up inside them." !  You just never kn.....wait a minute!  Now you mention it, I was at the Sugar Mill tother day and saw some ol' boy foamin' at the mouth!  And here I thought it was just a milk mustache!

If he genuinely felt that way, he could have simply resigned his commission and got out.

People in the military don't have the choice to reject or question orders. That's a load of crap. I don't care what you personally feel about the President. If you can't work for him, resign and leave. If he were enlisted, it'd be different. You're in until your eligable for discharge.

In the military, there is no free speech or due process. That's life.

Reason, I can't view the link you provided. But never mind as Snopes.com can hardly be trusted as an unbiased source of information. Sioux just posted a bunch of stuff today to prove that, including a Wikipedia entry that shows Snopes.com is owned by an ultraliberal couple. Regardless of whether the facsimile of the prez's birth certificate is a forgery (some experts think so as well as that birth announcement, by the way), only the long-form certificate that he keeps hidden will reveal for a fact whether he was born in Honolulu. The fact that Hawaii at the time gave Hawaiian birth certificates even to babies born overseas casts doubt over whether he was actually born there. Ditto for the ad. It doesn't say where he was born. Just that his birth took place.

tonyh, well, it's a damned shame that the soldier had to break the rules to prove that the president did the same.

He didn't have to break any rules. As I said before, he could have just resigned his commission and got out.

I'm not an "O" fan, but I also believe in the military way. It is what it is, and works very well.

It's obvious to me that you're not a Veteran..........................

tonyh, the military way isn't stopping a couple of more veterans from coming on board in support of the fired soldier, one a retired major general and the other an active Naval reservist lieutenant colonel: http://www.ledger-enquirer....

There is no rank of Lieutenant Colonel in the Navy. A Silver Oak Leaf Cluster would be a Commander in the Navy.

The Military is not a democracy, nor should it be. Nobody in today's Military was drafted. They all volunteered, just like I did when I was in. If a person wants to speak out against the system, then let them get out and do it as a civilian. That's their right to do so. But, while serving, they don't have that right. Rejecting orders is not an option.

Spin this any way you like. What that guy did was wrong, and that's all there is to it. It's grounds for a Court Martial. He screwed up big time.

 and the other an active Naval reservist lieutenant colonel:

Wow.

Tony hit the nail on the head.  There are channels to address your grievances, however, civilian courts is not one of them.  Every commander has an open door policy and, as a Major, it would have been to easy to take it to his commander and work the channels if it were a legitimate concern.  It's more of a publicity stunt than genuine concern about violating international law.  He's a Major in the US Army.  They are going to make an example out of this guy. 

At least Billy Mitchell had a valid cause.

heres a scenario that might not be appealing but possible given the direction the world is headed who knows??... if say you have a relative in the service and we go under martial law for whatever reason..if the occasion arises and hes told to shoot you in the head and he rejects that order he deserves to be court marshalled or shot himself??...at what point is right right and wrong wrong?? these are human beings not droids we are talking about.

The first step needs to be taken by somebody...there was alitttle thing called the american revolution..where would we be if those brave folks would have bent to every whim of their commanders and crown?

seems Patriotism is a failing commodity these days and its been replaced by greed and ignorance

I don't know what basic training is now. After the Mai Lei (sp?) Massacre in Nam, soldiers are educated as to what is and isn't a lawful order. Our troops are not expected to "follow orders" and execute prisoners or civilians.

By the way, pax, I just reread the comments and I owe you an apology for my own. I let my emotions get the better of me and vented them toward you. I shouldn't have. I'll try to pay closer attention to what I write before I post. 

No, I don't think you're insane. Misguided perhaps, but not insane. 

catpaw my response was to a statment that a soldier has no right to reject an order..I was trying to give an example as to where that might not be applicable so rejecting an order by a superior is a plausible reality in the service

Kudos Tony, as JF said hit it on the nail, 

Is that how you get around the facts, Pax?  You just dismiss anything you don't want to believe as "leftist"?  That's very childish.  Certainly, Snopes isn't the place to go for all things unchallenged, but I saw nothing in the source section of that article that is partisan.  All the sources were government agencies and places that, if you'd do your own homework (instead of taking your in box as Gospel), you could call up yourself and fact check.  Like I said in another of your posts on this subject - I did.  Of course, now you'll retort with something like "the entire government is in on the conspiracy" and we'll be back to square one.  In the beginning, you asked for a copy of the birth certificate.  One was provided.  You then move on to "well...well...that's hosted on a website I don't like so it's unreliable" (paraphrased).  Funny.  When people started commenting about this being a non-issue, you stated that it was because they didn't want to believe your source ("It's not the Huffington Post.").  Projecting much?  Why is it that only you can decide which sources should be considered valid?  Pax, aren't you a newspaper man?  Does this mean you only accept/write/print stories using "rightist" or "conservative" sources?

pax,

"Sioux just posted a bunch of stuff today to prove that, including a Wikipedia entry that shows Snopes.com is owned by an ultraliberal couple."

Did you actually read what he posted, and what I posted afterwards that methodically, shows that not only are the people that run snopes not liberal, one of them registered as a republican in 2000. They are anything but political, and have never ever tried to hide their identites (quite the opposite). If you actually read some of the political stuff on snopes you'd realize it. The whole email about the sign in front of State Farm was 100% bogus.

Soldiers are supposed to obey all lawful orders.  The Major disputes the authority of those orders based on the President and an officers authority is given by the president.  It may have had an ounce of validity if it through his chain of command.  He would still have to deploy and obey the orders of his immediate command.  The guy violates military professional ethics by undermining his entire command and displaying insubordination to those that serve under him.  If he's a Major, more than likely he works in a significant staff position at the Battalion level (Executive Officer or Operations Officer).  He has a direct effect on the entire battalion (1000+ troops) !!  Would you want that guy to be on your staff if you are a commander?

I've had soldiers that have either filed for a discharge under compassionate circumstances or they wanted conscientious objector status.  They still have to perform their daily duties until the command decides otherwise on the issue.  Simply put, the Major violated his oath as a commissioned officer, which is legal grounds to be treated like the lowliest Private without pay.

one of them registered as a republican in 2000

I was a liberal Republican about 13 years ago (quit laughing).

Pax, info, sioux: I've thought it over. Maybe you're right.

Obama was maybe born in Kenya. He is really, secretly a Muslim Socialist, and has a grand plan to make the U.S. follow sharia law and Communism. His nefarious plan has begun, first by destroying the economy. Because he hates capitalism. He only wants to dominate and control the people of the world.

So, when we're all broke (except for Goldman Sachs employees), we will be forced to look to him and the government, as they're one and the same, for everything. And, since he'll have Congress, the courts, not to mention the complete and entire military under his control, they'll do his bidding...and we of course won't have any guns anymore, since he personally will repeal the Second Amendment.

Then he force us all to convert to Islam and pledge loyalty to the memory of Karl Marx in order to get the things we need to survive. if we don't comply, we will be sent to FEMA re-education camps until we see the light. Once he has us all under his complete control, he will hand over the keys to the White house to Osama Bin Laden.

This has been the plan all along. Sept. 11 was just the opening move in a really elaborate plot by terrorists to take over the United States.

[buzzer sound] You know, I thought if I typed it out, somehow, maybe your deranged postings would make sense. It's not even a good plot idea for a bad movie.

He swore an oath--and an officer no less--so he knows the rules and laws..both civilian and the UCMJ...

This is an embarassement--he doesn't deserve further comment from me--but what do I know--I was just a lowly Staff NCO that did what I was ordered to do--without question or second thought....

That Major was trained by a staff NCO like all other junior officers were..  He knows better.

PP you sound like a stuck record..eww did you not read my response on the other blog you are so proud of your self on??

come on guys..nothing in our history has ever come up like this before...there isnt a precedence on how to react..and being sheep dont cut it

JF: A liberal republican,,,still laughing I have never heard that one

Delusional.

yeah, I was (delusional).

jfrancis~ lol...you know,I hope, my comment was not directed at you.

there isnt a precedence on how to react..and being sheep dont cut it

There is quite a precedent on insubordination.  It's one of the few crimes in the army punishable by death during wartime.