Many many years ago the County offerred voluntary furloughs to employees to help in a budget crunch and to "help prevent layoffs".  It was a mess as someone else had to pick up the slack on "furlough days".  Certainly the work will still have to be done, no matter how the State staggers the furlough days.

Well, it's better then what we have in the private sector, picking up all the slack when they eliminate a job.  And then don't give you a raise for the extra work. 

So, having to "Chip" in one or two days a month, isn't going to really get much sympathy from a lot of people.

It will be a problem for certain offices that are seeing an increase in workload as other agencies try to balance their budget by playing a complex juggling game. Eventually, all the cleavers are going to come crashing down on the poor juggler... cut the pay of state lawmakers so they actually do something to prevent this eventuality. That's my take on it.

I see we have another state worker hater.  You don't know what you're talking about.  We're already picking up the slack since they don't replace laid off or retired workers.  We're already having to do more with less time, and since some of us don't get overtime pay for working overtime, with two mandated days off, the work load will only increase, and you're going to find that those of us who are already working at capacity are not going to be able to provide you with the same level of service that you'd like.  And I don't want to hear how that level of service is already eroded - I work hard for my paycheck and I expect more from myself than the average person, and many of my co-workers have the same work ethics. But then, I should not have to defend myself, but it's people like you who think you are so superior because you work in the private sector.  Bahhumbug on that!

The thing that most people who don't work for the state don't get is that some of us actually took a decent pay cut to go to work for the state.  I personally took about a 18% hit to my bottom line, when you add in the 2 days per month that I will be giving up in addition to the initial pay cut, that puts me making 28% less than I was 2.5 years ago.  I went to work for the state because for the stability and the benefits, now that my benefits are being cut, and the stability is not so stable, did I make the right choice?

Oh yeah, those furlough days won't go unpaid, we'll get the hours "on the books" to use as days off at a later date, still doesn't do my bank account any good.

Flame Away

With double digit unemployment rates, people having NO jobs, businesses closing as well as laying off employees, low holiday hiring rates, and Christmas upon us, it might behoove the state workers to be grateful they have a job.  A lot of folks aren't as lucky.  

As for wages, a co worker of mine left the county to go to work at the prison and almost doubled her pay.  That's not chicken feed.

These are tough times for many of us and state workers aren't the only ones suffering

Why should the governor balance the budget on the backs of the state workers? We didn't create this mess.  Why don't the legislators give up their per diem for starters? They haven't accomplished anything since November.  First I get threatened with no pay check, then they pass a budget that's only good for 3 months?  What kind of sense does that make? 

Trust me, I am grateful that I have a job, nobody owes it to me, I earned it, I have a skill, a trade that I perform in return for wages paid. Now all of a sudden, the other 1/2 of the equation wants to change the rules midstream, that's not my idea of fair.  Would the state be willing to let me take 2 days off a month and get paid for them? I didn't think so. As for your friend that left the county, I'd be willing to bet that (s)he is either a correctional officer? or medical staff, or the county job really sucked, whatever the case may be, I know what CDCR pay scales are, they suck.

I'd like to know just how many state workers make over $200,000/year and how many make over $100,000/year.  I have heard that it is a lot more than one would think. 

 "Why should the governor balance the budget on the backs of the state workers?"

Hmm...

You have to admit, it's not an unreasonable place to start.

We can start with the CDC budget - that's the largest piece of the pie.

--virgil

We got a drug  war we've been paying for, too....

All those state workers paid to watch, then prosecute and paid to watch again...and, then paid to watch again after those combatants ( druggies) are released from the second watching.

--virgil

I am grateful to have a job - most definitely.  I definitely understand what a hole our state is in, and we all have to suffer. My family finances have taken a deep hit this year already, just like many others.  The problem is, I pay taxes too - which many of those in the private sector do not seem to understand.  I also, through my job, contribute a tremendous amount to helping those less fortunate and those who have been taken advantage of by unscrupulous people.  But I am growing tired of the government making us bail out business after business because they made selfish irresponsible decisions, making us responsible for those homeowners who irresponsibly got into mortages they couldn't afford, and now we're responsible for helping those do-nothings in Sacramento that are more concerned with taking care of #1 than really searching for ways to cut spending by cutting the graft and corruption that you know exists in all politics.

Over $200,000?  Over $100,000.  Oh please - don't make me laugh.  I wish!

Over 100K? Yeah right! I wish I made anywhere near that number. Maybe you should check your source.

And,

everyone knows if you work in law enforcement or corrections or probation then there is a lot of overtime to be had; and, with the benefits... brings any front-line drug war soldier's package well over a $100,000 a year.

You're being disingenuous to talk otherwise.

--virgil

cllick-click .....   click-click.....     click-click.....      click-click.....   The sound of virgils broken record.

I dunno ...my niece has worked for the state prison system for 18 years, I'll have to ask her how much she makes.    Not that she'd tell me, but I'm guessing she would give a big "I wish"  at the 100-200K number too.  I think that's a tad high for the average employee.  Maybe in upper supervisory positions.

inlcuding benefits and overtime, Nancy?

--virgil

I asked the question because I've heard it was somewhere in the thousands of employees.  I did not, nor do not infer that any state employee posting comments on this blog are or have been in any way overpaid.  So please, holster those guns.

I those folks in CDC do make pretty decent money.  I think starting out is close to 6 figures (80k?).  They had an advertisement on a billboard between Fresno and Bakersfield when I lived there stating the starting salaries. I had a buddy who left the NFL (injured) to work in CA corrections.  He's never given me an exact figure (I would never ask him) but he is doing quite well(has a business degree).

Virgil sounds jealous of law enforcement. Maybe a personal problem with the law? Hmmmmm.  Or maybe just another hater. (I'm not in corrections nor am I a peace officer.)  Every time the budget gets bad, the general consensus is to dump on state employees, as if we caused it.  You really should start at the top - management and above - to weed out the waste and cut the spending.  The rank and file employees are required to follow their orders, we don't set the policies.  There is one Agency I know of that wasted millions of dollars in the past few years on a failed computer software program only to scrap it.  But no one is held accountable.  That is just one small example of waste and spending that we are all paying for.

When I worked for the county they took $350 per month out of my check for retirement.  Mandatory.  That was a llittle painful considering I was also paying into SS but the benefits would be reaped down the road.  When most people are paying the rent and the bills, they may be getting benefits but benefits aren't living wages.  Try telling PG7E you'll pay them when you get your benefits.

I understand that those things all add up to the employers cost of doing business and having employees but it doesn't mean the employee has that much available net or discretionary income.

Oh quit trying to bash the state and county workers as usual VIRGIL. I know an enormous amount of people who work in the private sector who in salary alone make over $100,000 and then you add the benefits and stock matching and 401k matching also. The private sector is more vast in numbers than any government workforce.

Businesses like Schlumberger, Occidental, Halliburton, Berry Petroleum, Chevron, Mobil, Exxon all have management making more than $100,000 easily. And yes most dont not have a college education and they did start at an entry level position just like every Law Enforcement jobs you think All make over $100,000 a year.

I know many Law Enforcement officers that make well over $100,000  a year because they are very much overtime hounds. But most I know allow their spouses to take care of their children by not working, and several are trying to pay for their spouse or themselves or even their children to get a colleg education. It all costs money these days VIRGIL. As you know it does take 2 sources of income these days to sustain a household comfortably.

And just so you know VIRGIL.......most overtime has been cut way back since long before the budget shortfalls anticipating what was coming.

I have better ideas of using bailout funds that would actually generate monies without raising taxes AND not laying the costs on the backs of the corporations that must eat all the bad mortgage debt. I also have ideas where to cut other government funding by applying my ideas too that would save billions. But our law makers dont lend an ear to the general tax paying citizen for ideas.

So all the way around the economy is bad. So quit trying to bash the government employees for the problems VIRGIL. We all need each other to make the world go around and this time of the year is stressful enough  without fearing a jobloss, shorted paychecks, and most of all being made to look like you are to blame for the economy problems.

"Virgil sounds jealous of law enforcement. Maybe a personal problem with the law? Hmmmmm"

Calliegirl,

you're not trying to be my friend, are you?

It sounds like you should know better ... my emotional attitude about law enforcement has nothing to do with the reality that ten percent of the California state budget is consumed by the Department of corrections.

I'm not even talking about what we pay as californians for law enforcement to watch marijuana smokers and cocaine users.

--virgil

We are also helping to raise countless illegal aliens children. What a savings it would be if we just cut welfare benefits of all kinds to illegal aliens. If our local paper tells us that we spend 11 billion a year on illegals, it would seem to me the place to start cutting. It also would mean all those remittance $$$$$$ wouldn't be going to foreign countries, that money would be being spent here at home. I could go on, and on, but I,m not in any mood. Our people suffer while letting these criminals stay here. I don't get it. Maybe all you state employees should start voicing your opinions. The Governor should as heck don't listen to me.

click.-click....  cllick-click.....   click-click......

Well said, S.Wright.  Thank you. And you're so right - no one listens.  It's too logical and we all know government  is not logical.  (and Virgil - it's not "call girl", its Callie girl - and I am not your friend, you are too focused on marijuana and related law enforcement activities)

Proam even my co-workers who were almost all Hispanic agreed about the illegals.  It's hard to get anything done when you're called a bigot for wanting to enforce our borders and our laws.  But I agree...sumpin ought to be done.  Another pet peeve of mine too.

edited..now I'm going go make some popcorn and watch Master and Commander. 

Nancy II, I also have Hispanic friends that hate this situation. I've told them that their voices would be louder than mine. I often think that these stupid politicians think that all Hispanics are for amnesty. That is just not true! When Bush pushed forward cross border trucking one of my Mexican Friends said " those Mexicans doing cross border trucking are nothing more than Mexican Scabs". It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out his mindset.

Here you go, the quick and easy way to answer the salary question: www.sacbee.com/statepay/ You do have to break it down by agency though. The website does not allow just searches on salary.

Let's take CSUB as an example. Plug in "Bakersfield State" on the website and you get that they have 801 employees in that particular database. Now refine that search to a base salary >100k and you get 58 results. So 7% of CSUB employees make more than 100k. If you look at the job titles, many of those people are administrators or department chairs. If you sort the results by base pay, you'll see only 2 people at CSUB make more than 200k.

It's a great little website to play around with. Got to love what newspapers can do when it comes to public records. It is a tiny bit out of date (last year's salary numbers I believe), but close enough for this sort of inquiry.

" and Virgil - it's not "call girl", its Callie girl - and I am not your friend, you are too focused on marijuana and related law enforcement activities)"

Actually,

I saw the mispell and fixed it ..sorry.

Now about marijuana and being focused... We would actually save a great deal of money ( that is, resources ) if we focus a bit on the failures of the drug war ( especially now when we are looking at such a massive budget shortfall). 

We spend a great deal on it : surveillance, prosecution, incarceration and post-incarceration monitoring...for marijuana smokers and cocaine users.

I'm not focused on marijuana per se. But it does happen to be the substance ( behind alcohol and cigarettes) most abused  in California, thereby we use great deal of money and resources watching those who smoke it.

--virgil

Here you go, the quick and easy way to answer the salary question: www.sacbee.com/statepay/ 

Thanks  for the Link ...

--virgil

I have a question.  What ever did VIRGIL do before he learned how to cut and paste ??

"What ever did VIRGIL do before he learned how to cut and paste ??"

I did a lot of talking to myself...

I take it you don't agree with me.

--virgil

If you are going to complain about the tax rate. I don’t want to hear you complain about the pay.

For everyone else. My condolences.

Overtime? What's that? Unless you're a C/O or medical staff, there is no such thing as OT anymore, I've been with the state 3 years, and maybe worked 30 hours of OT. 

If I were a state worker...I would tell these people in Sacramento to quit cutting checks for more than whats in the account...now how many of us can write checks for more than whats in your account--no one--not if you want to keep a roof over your head--keep the lights and heat on--or to buy groceries--etc..

And why is it that every time there is a crisis..the low man on the totum pole always takes it in the shorts..NOT Big Mama or Big Daddy sitting in the States Capital...oh no--not them...heaven forbid...

And QUIT trying to pass something and naming it something else--in a nutshell,its called taxes...just like peeing down our backs and telling us that it is raining....

I glad that it was caught...but IF I was a state worker--I'd be raising hell about right now....

Hang On State Workers!!!!!! As usual there are a bunch of state worker haters on here that think WE are responsible for the yearly budget...It happens every year. Oh, we make to much, we can afford to work for free, blah blah blah....As usual Nancy II, you have no facts just opinion...Yes as a matter of fact we do make a decent living, but we also work our a$$' off in a high stress job whether it be the DMV, Corrections, Social services or any other faction of the State. We deserve every red cent we get. The teachers are sorely underpaid and sould be getting war pay for teaching the brats they have to put up with due to budget crunching in a 40 child classrom with no aide...I am happily retired from Corrections and worked hard to take care of pampered felons that dear old Arnie' the Repub set up to increase assaults on staff by severly cutting staffing and all other programs, including overcrowding, exporting, driving the budget up in excess of billions of dollars. Why can't he be held responsible for turning our state upside down. Maybe he should be deported with the rest of the illegal aliens that you all talk about!!! State Workers, stand tall.You have alot to be proud of, ignore the republican organized labor haters out there, instead, maybe you should not worry about getting time on your books, but on your assigned furlough day use your sick time and call in and let the so called management, that there is not enough of, attempt to protect and provide service to these unappreciative patrons that depend on us more than they know!!! They will start a blog right away to Mr.Arnie pleading to him to put you back on payroll only to get the everyday service that they so depend on while they stand in line and bitch.....

One of the major problems is that the state is authorized by law to operate without a budget.  What sense does that make?  Coorective action on that issue is a step in the right direction.

The one thing that we've learned with the events thats happened our the period of months is that no ones job--reguardless of industry--private-local-state-federal..is immune to being cut back...

Until the dust settles on this thing, I for one am not going to get worked up over events that I have no control of..no matter how many e-mails I send to OUR elected officals---They are going to do what they will..all I can do is remember next election and vote in someone whom can do the job at hand...I've had enough sunshine blown my way since I've been old enough to vote-(35 yrs.) that I should light up like a super nova...

As for the state workers that's going to get the ax..I feel bad for you all....no one likes loosing their jobs...but you are not alone..unemployment is climbing every day..and I really don't see an end in sight....

When Arnold decreased the vehicle registration. He created a 4 billion dollar budget deficit  all on his very own.
That’s 4 billion in one year.
Multiply that by 6 years and you have accounted for 24 billion dollars of current deficit. OPPs, Our current deficit is only about 14 billion.
Yeh, I would say we could be sitting in tall cotton today without the registration reduction.

Please read the following.
From Fox News :
6 Oct. 2003


Schwarzenegger has said his top priority is to roll back a recent tripling of the vehicle registration tax. That alone would increase the budget deficit by $4 billion. His solution — to tax Indian casinos — would involve re-negotiating compacts with 61 tribes — a difficult task that will not be helped by Schwazenegger's campaign advertisements criticizing Indian gambling. He also wants to renegotiate contracts with the state employees' unions.
http://www.foxnews.com/stor...

TK continues:

(the tripling was actually a return to 1990's registration levels)

 "When Arnold decreased the vehicle registration..."

good point....

Arnold did that way back when he still saw himself as the Republican fixer - wasn't that about the same time the Bush administration sent everybody a $600.oo check?

--virgil

There is nothing we can do to prevent the bad days ahead. Arnolds furlough and pay cuts are going to affect every single business person in California. There are tens of  thousands of government employees in Kern.

A ¾ percent sales tax increase is  regressive in some ways.

BUT:
So is 15% unemployment and the cutting of wages.

To get us back to the great country we were. We must have jobs that pay enough that a single person can buy a home.

That’s the way it was in California before Reganomics became the Governor of Californian. After Reagonomics,  it took a married couple to purchase a home.

We can you back and forth all day saying this and that...what is the solution?..I gotta go pay bills now..and I know EXACTLY whats in my account...do they?

“The thing that most people who don't work for the state don't get is that some of us actually took a decent pay cut to go to work for the state.  I personally took about a 18% hit to my bottom line, when you add in the 2 days per month that I will be giving up in addition to the initial pay cut, that puts me making 28% less than I was 2.5 years ago.  I went to work for the state because for the stability and the benefits, now that my benefits are being cut, and the stability is not so stable, did I make the right choice?”

 That depends.

Traditional comparisons of public v/s private sector pay ignore some important realities.

 A straight comparison is invalid since most folks in the private sector are never lifetime employed. The financial losses of being between jobs is never factored into the comparison. Add that simple reality and public pay for equal work should be at least 10% less than private sector work.

Consider the much more generous pension and health plans (benefits) available on average to public sector employees, and you’ll need to subtract another 10% to 20% from base pay for public sector employees.

Traditionally, public employees were willing to take less pay in trade for job security, and being insulated from the realities of the risk of the private sector.

Pension benifits are the biggest long term drain on the taxpayer. Consider that a public employee can work 25 years, then draw tax money for not working for another 20 to 25 years. This doubles the stated amount of pay for every unit of work performed for the taxpayer by the public employee.

Many draw money for being “retired”, yet work another job. A classic example of a moral hazard. If a person can still work, why are they drawing a retirement pension from the taxpayer?

The best long term solution would be to give the state workers a 10% raise, inform them on how to start a retirement savings account, and stop the taxpayer supported pensions.

It’s called personal responsibility,  would serve the public best in the long run, and save the net taxpayer a lot of money..

Don,

Giving up a fixed pension plan for a individual retirement plan is called ignorance not personal responsibility. Have you checked out the Stock market as of late.

I have no problem with 401’s or IRA’s as a play thing designed to replace a trip to the casino.

But why suffer to be the poor boy in the Ponzi scheme.

Personal responsibility is joining with your fellow employees and insuring your retirement and health care  under a Fixed pension plan.

The workforce is full of people unable to gather the courage to stand up to their employers and demand what is due them.

Those that wish to float through life wishing and praying their lottery ticket will come in. Deserve what they get. And in most cases it is the short end of the stick. 

Hi Tkozy,

I think you’re missing the concept here.

Allowing a parental authority figure to take responsibility always leads to the same result.

For example, a private IRA or 401K, that the owner allowed to be managed by a typical investment firm suffered the same fate as the investments managed by Public employee pension plans..they all lost big time. Problem is, public employees will expect the fixed pension to be maintained anyway off the backs of the net taxpayer.

They lost because both the individual investor and the public investment managers didn’t take responsibility to personally research what was really happening in the real world with their money.

Gosh, how could they have lost money when the paid financial advisers looked so official in their Armani suits, $100 haircuts, and opulent offices? 

Assuming that an institution of money changers will look out for the little guy is always folly, and always creates a moral hazard.

Consider the alternative. If each individual took responsibility, this meltdown would never have happened. A wise individual would demand full transparency in all financial dealings, and firms (or banks) that are perceived as shady would fail quickly as individuals removed their funds, instead of assuming that the parental authority figure would ”take care of me”.

Most Americans don’t understand our Ponzi based fractional banking system, and our present situation is the result. An ignorant person is very easy to con. But of course, ignorance is a choice made by the individual.

I personally don’t have a lot of money saved back for retirement as this point, but I didn’t lose a dime in the present situation.

The writing was on the wall for the present crash back in 2005, as housing prices exceeded the fundamentals of the market, and  unregulated financial engineering ran wild.

I put my retirement savings into physical gold. This was a no risk move, since our massive private and public debt was sure to tank the US Dollar, and it has.

Back then, most folks thought I was nuts.   "Housing always goes up"!   lol

In late July, I sold 25% of the gold, and purchased petroleum futures, because it was fairly certain at that point that commodities were poised to crash. Those gains were used to buy back more gold.

I’m up net 60% after taxes and fees since 2005, because I rejected the advice of the Armani suited financial advisers, and decided to think for myself. 

That’s personal responsibility.

And it was far less of a gamble than trusting the “system”.

BTW: I’m self employed.

Cheers!