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witbee - > Whit's End -> Grades: Testing and Grading
Grades: Testing and Grading

Wow, this whole thing posted with no text so now I am re-writing it from memory.

 

I'm sitting here on the last day of school as students are finishing up their finals and I'm pondering the merits of our current system of grading students. I can remember many of my teachers never explaining how we got graded. Some of them undoubtedly gave us whatever grade they "thought" we earned. They were probably right, too. But it is better that we have a set system in place for determining student achievement.

     A few years ago I had a student, repeating the class for the third time. He decided to show up only on the first day and for quarterly exams. At the end of the semester he was surprised to find out he was failing. He figured that if he could pass the test, he should pass the class. I told him to re-read his syllabus and see that passing the test was only a small part of passing the class. He finally accepted it, but was not convinced he shouldn't pass the class.

     There are many alternative methods to grading, but the old stand-by of "X% for tests, X% for classwork, X% for projects" is probably the best for our educational system. The nice thing about this is you can design a class so that is it is research-oriented, lecture-oriented or lab-oriented and still use the scheme. The bottom line is, you have to do the daily work.

    Each week I begin my class with a study of the weeks vocabulary. This work is a large part of the students grades since it is done every week. Still, in my lower level classes, many students choose either not to do it or not to turn it in. Why? They don't care about the daily work. Oh, they want to pass the class and they will study hard for the quiz on Friday, but the commitment to do their work every day is just not there.

     How do we make students "want" to do their work? How do we give them ambition and drive? You've seen he movies where a teacher goes into a tough classroom and the students all change to sweetness and light. Remember, those are movies based loosely on what really happened. The vast majority of the time, ambition comes from home, not school.

So, what do you think? Should students be graded on the end product (tests) or should they be graded on their daily work? Or do you have a better idea?

Posted in the Schools & Education interest group.
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posted by witbee on Thursday, June 5, 2008 at 11:00 AM
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15 comments from 8 users

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posted by Shwaine on Jun 6, 2008 at 07:49 PM

I'm glad you have a mentor. It's always good to have someone that can guide you in the process.

posted by jfrancais on Jun 6, 2008 at 12:14 PM

Holy crap! I didn't realize how important those things were until I was immersed in it. Did you get a new advisor?

posted by witbee on Jun 6, 2008 at 11:47 AM

Good to hear. Congrats!

My Masters degree advisor had a triple bypass in the middle of my tenure. It pretty much sidelined my progress for 6 months.

posted by jfrancais on Jun 6, 2008 at 10:51 AM

Overall, I was disappointed with the graduate program at CSUF but I figured if my grade wasn't really affected by it it didn't make since to put the prof "on blast" (they inflate grades anyway). I might send an email to clarify (and so I have something in writing should my grade be negatively affected). It also didn't help that the department chair for my program was not very accessible (my degree was almost cancelled due to his failure to turn in a clearance form). I'd prefer a vague syllabus over one that's rigid then it's altered to something very different. I did find a good mentor, however. He's down to earth and guides me through the bureaucracy that is CSUF.

posted by witbee on Jun 6, 2008 at 10:37 AM

When I taught junior college, I was never detailed on dates. I had a weekly objective and that was it. Tests were often pushed off a day or two depending on the speed of the class. I was told that once it was in writing, you were bound by school policy to stick to it. Maybe CSUF is different.

I would never have complained when I was in school, though. You make moise, you become a target.

posted by Shwaine on Jun 5, 2008 at 08:31 PM

Some faculty have difficulty planning the whole quarter/semester in advance and don't leave enough wiggle room in their syllabus for in-class adjustments. That may be an answer as to why they change the syllabus. Now, as far as what to do about it, go to the department chair and/or graduate program coordinator and discuss the problem, particularly if it is negatively affecting your progress. If you have a research advisor, that would be another person to go to about the issue. I never had a syllabus issue in any of my graduate school courses, but I did turn to the graduate coordinator and my research advisor for help in other areas. That's one of the things they're there for.

posted by jfrancais on Jun 5, 2008 at 03:22 PM

Speaking of syllabi, I have a problem with professors at Fresno State (the ones in the grad school, anyway). They seem to use it as merely a guideline and arbitrarilly make changes throughout the semester that do not coincide with the syllabus. I was always under the impression that it was a contract between professor and student. How can one change the terms of the "agreement"?

posted by montfred on Jun 5, 2008 at 02:05 PM

Concerning your dilemma, "Wow, this whole thing posted with no text so now I am re-writing it from memory." may I suggest you write your posts in a word-processing program, and paste them into this application.  Then if something goes wrong during your 'posting,' you have the option to just re-paste your words. 

 I'm earning my degree through on-line courses, I study the class syllabus, as soon as it becomes available, I outline my day planner accordingly, its working out pretty good.

I am so happy that my final class ends tomorrow.  Unfortunately, summer classes start up Monday, and I'll be be busy updating my calendar again.  

I have taught at vocational colleges for years, and am looking forward to earning that degree, and teaching those classes on-line. 



posted by Shwaine on Jun 5, 2008 at 01:50 PM

If we're talking about college level classes, then following the requirements of the syllabus should be how the grade is determined. Even though some of the students may turn their nose up at what they perceive to be "busy work", they aren't following the "contract" laid out in the syllabus, so they should not receive the same overall grade as someone who did do all the coursework (assuming they had equitable performance on the exams). I think some students lose sight of the fact that college is preparing them to enter the workforce and many jobs require their employees to follow their job contract, no matter how trivial the employee feels the tasks are. So it's not all about acing the tests; it's about sticking to the syllabus, both on the part of the student and the instructor.

posted by witbee on Jun 5, 2008 at 01:45 PM

In my class, there is more emphasis on classwork and Labwork than tests. In truth, if you show up every day, turn in all your work on time and do a half decent job, you will do well. I do this because I myself am a horrible test taker. I don't even assign homework unless you don't finish your classwork.

A big problem for my lower level students is turning the work in on time. If it is late, there is a penalty. If it is really late, it is worthless. Apparently the junior highs in Delano allow a lot of late work and some of these kids have gotten used to turning all there work in at the end of the quarter.

Enabling procrastination is a bad thing.

posted by jfrancais on Jun 5, 2008 at 12:32 PM

After failing out of college. I came back with the mentality that if I showed for every class and turned in every assignment I could pas the class (it worked). What do you think of such policy if it was instituted by an instructor such as yourself? I always thought it would increase the chances of having an interactive environment in the classroom and prevent days where there are no prepared students for class. 

posted by adampayne on Jun 5, 2008 at 12:19 PM

I think an apportioned percentage for tests, classwork and projects is the most objective barometer to gauge results. Finding the switch that turns on the active button of learning for students is the most difficult knob to find. I am continually dismayed by the current classroom structure where one teacher is accountable for so many students of differing backgrounds and skill sets. There is never adequate time to reach every young person and help them work through the process.  Only the most determined and brightest children with active familial support have much chance of making it through the torturous obstacle course of public learning.

I certainly have great empathy for all teachers trying to work within this terrible personnel system of administration-heavy and classroom-light school world.  I have wondered for a long time why children's value seems to shrink with age. We mandate at pre-school (where children are far easier to control) at least one supervisor/adult per six toddlers. We then move to a system where one adult becomes responsible for as many as forty kids in a classroom from K-12. Many collegiate courses at large universities and junior colleges can have hundreds of students per professor/lecturer. And people question why there are so few college graduates as a percentage of our population. Add to all this the vast economic disparities that schools and their students operate under and you  begin to  understand  why a large percentage of failure must be the real societal goal.

I believe more teaching assistants should be employed at every classroom and standard learning materials should be available to all classes. It is wrong that some students in certain district schools in America are afforded computers at every desk and interact with Power Point presentations while other classrooms still endure scrawl on chalk or ill lit overhead-projectors that leave them with serious learning disadvantages and the stigma of being less than worthy.

Good luck, and thanks for the thoughtful post. Your job is very difficult.

 

posted by dgrealish on Jun 5, 2008 at 11:52 AM

When I was in school, I did the homework.  Had I not, I wouldn't have aced the tests.  But I often didn't turn in homework because it didn't meet my standards.  The handwriting wasn't neat enough, the columns weren't straight enough, the work wasn't neat enough.  It took me a long time to realize the work didn't have to look perfect to be good enough to turn in.

posted by Tiffanilynn on Jun 5, 2008 at 11:49 AM

 I believe that as kids, we dont really focus on school.... i know that my parents installed the fear of working at McDonalds for the rest of my life in me (even though i never worked at one lol)... which made me want to do good in school, I was a 3.8 gpa honor student, but there were times i was "just to lazy" to do my homework ect ect....

I think that they way grades are done now are good, because not everyone is going to be good at homework/projects or tests... maybe someone excels a little more in one area. I know that it didnt matter how much i studied i SUCKED at tests, i could know the answer and still get it wrong (im not even joking).

Also, Like in the movies, i have seen that happen, i was that class. Senior year of high school (centennial) i was in a math class full of students and we were a crazy group, did what we wanted, i think at the begining of the year we all were failing this class, then the teacher and us built such a strong bond.... all of his students left his class with good grades and respect. thanks Mr. Davenport.

posted by sagefever on Jun 5, 2008 at 11:40 AM

All the classes I ever retained anything from,were,as you describe,a combo~ class participation,tests and projects .My ambition started from home,but fairly soon became self driven~ the love of knowledge.My only problem now is remembering where I "put" it!


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