Thanks for your comments and the link re this film.  Someone recommended that we go see it, but I didn't know anything about it.  Bozell's article is an interesting review.

 Although I have no problem with alternate views, evolution is every bit as real as gravity. There really is no debate about evolution, only the mechanism that makes it happen.

Let me ask you this Wayfarer. Do you believe that Creationism is a viable idea that should be taught as scientific fact?

http://www.rottentomatoes.c... Several reviews at this site,were the film gets a 13%,the best being 100%...if needs be one must see it,I do a DVD rental,it will be out soon enough. 

 I see some things as good explanations in evolutionary theory for instance the ability of a creature to adapt to changes in the environment.  This is evidence to me of the Wisdom of God.  But I haven't seen evidence of a new species evolving from another one and I absolutely reject the materialist reductions of mankind to mere animals.  Revelation from God the Creator is quite clear that God breathed spirit into man and made him a unique creature that exist both in the material and spiritual worlds.  Some versions of Creationism seem equally to be pseudo science and a lack of understanding of scripture.  I feel entirely comfortable in saying that I don't know the exact mechanisms or time table that God created the universe and if it was necessary for my salvation God would have made it abundantly clear to us.  But I do know the evolutionary theory is not the final answer and our sciences shouldn't be reduced to shaping theories so that they fit evolutionary theory model.  All that does is stifle science in the same manner that the once widely accepted theory of the sun orbiting the earth did.

There *IS* repression involved in the academic fight over evolution.  Good instructors who wanted to teach real science--that is, evolution and not creationism--have been fired. None have been fired over wanting to teach creationism. 

The movie is a sham.   (And, by the expectations set up by the producers, a commercial flop.)

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But that didn't stop the sequel, soon to be available at a theater near you:

http://www.youtube.com/watc...

 http://www.expelledexposed....

We underestimated the creationists before, don't underestimate them again. The Stork Theory WILL replace true science in sex education, if the creationists get their way here.

It does open certain population-control avenues.  We could reduce the number of pregnancies simply by substituting stork for turkey on Thanksgiving... 

I take it that Random is trying to say that he is passionately opposed to keeping an open mind to alternative theories. 

I am not sure what Creationism could have done to improve it's chances as being seen as a legitimate alternative theory~~~but this movie was not the right avenue.

Spam Code:ESGOD....i kid you not...

While roving interviewer Ben Stein extracts some choice soundbites from scientists on both sides of the creation-vs.-evolution debate, the film's flippant approach undermines the seriousness of its discourse, trading less in facts than in emotional appeals.
Justin Chang, Variety

While he gets points for addressing the debate, the way in which Stein goes about it undermines his efforts to be even-handed and intellectually rigorous.
Claudia Puig, USA Today

This is propaganda, a political rant disguised as a serious commentary on stifled freedom of inquiry.
Claudia Puig, USA Today

It's hard to pinpoint what's most insulting about this obvious propaganda piece.
 Ken Fox, TV Guide

Surely the film's greatest offense is the utter shamelessness with which it exploits the Holocaust.
Ken Fox, TV Guide

Bizarre and hysterical.
Vadim Rizov, Village Voice

Expelled is an unprincipled propaganda piece that insults believers and nonbelievers alike.
Mark Olsen, Los Angeles Times

Managing to make the films of Michael Moore and Morgan Spurlock look like dry, scholarly treatises by comparison, Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed more than lives up to its subtitle.
Frank Scheck, The Hollywood Reporter

Regardless of your personal views, Expelled's heavy-handed bias (a visit to Darwin's home gets the same eerie music as a tour of Dachau) is exasperating.
Adam Markovitz, Entertainment Weekly

Stein's schlumpy presence is disarming, though his know-it-all nature is at odds with his free-speech posing.
Joe Neumaier, New York Daily News

The movie itself is an example of design by faith and emotion rather than intelligence, defined as rationality grounded in proof.
Neil Minow, Chicago Sun-Times

One of the sleaziest documentaries to arrive in a very long time, Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed is a conspiracy-theory rant masquerading as investigative inquiry.
Jeannette Catsoulis, New York Times

Stein claims to denounce the tyranny of dogma, then browbeats us with his own.
Rafer Guzman, Newsday

Stein spends the first half of the movie setting himself a trap, and the second half squirming in it.
Kyle Smith, New York Post

It shows us bogus security files, as if some cabal is spying on everyone. It shirks the facts. And it madly edits images to equate Darwin with Hitler, and Ben Stein with -- yes -- Ronald Reagan. Typical of all propaganda, it also distorts language.
Stephen Whitty, Newark Star-Ledger

Stein's credibility is blown on this poorly constructed diatribe, and you'd be smart to save your bucks.
Matt Stephens. E! Online

A cynical attempt to sucker Christian conservatives into thinking they're losing the 'intelligent design' debate because of academic 'prejudice.'
Roger Moore, Orlando Sentinel

Wow TSM!  Did you have to look up each of those quotes separately or were they all in one spot? 

They were in two spots. The reviews from average people who saw the movie was overwhelmingly negative as well.

And I have to give you credit. I expected to you to be true to form and delete my post.

I only do that when someone tries to turn my spiritual posts into a soapbox for secularism or is just plain disrespectful and obnoxious.  

Not at all, Buffoo.  If you want to believe in the stork, feel free.  Just don't try to slip it into the classroom.

I only do that when someone tries to turn my spiritual posts into a soapbox for secularism or is just plain disrespectful and obnoxious. 

You're lying.

I've seen you delete posts simply because you've disagreed with something they've said.

 Well Wayfarer, at least you consider evolution as the possible mechanism that a God might employ to create man.

After all, if God uses physics, the elements, and man himself to accomplish his goals, (eg the Great Flood, the burning of Sodom and Gommorah etc), then maybe evolution isn't necessarily contrary to your beliefs. 

After all, I'm pretty sure you don't take every passage in the Bible literally.

 That's not what I said Anti.  I said that adaption by creatures to the environment is an observable fact.  The evolution of one species into another is speculation that has never been demonstrated as true and I definitely put my foot down on any theory that man evolved from a subhuman creatures.  In no way do I accept evolutionary theory or intelligent design of man from non human creatures.  Of course I believe in the laws if science ,but I do not believe that the Omniscient God can be bound by the laws He created and is free to circumvent them as He wills.   Which leads to the term "Miracle" those super natural events that can not be explained naturally.  A point of interest when a miracle does occurs such as a myrrh weeping Icon.  The first thing the Bishop does is have scientific experts examine the case to rule out any natural explanation before he rules that it is a genuine miracle.  He also checks that the case is not a demonic deception.  As the Saints have experienced the devil can manifest itself as an angel of light or even pose as a vision of the Lord himself. 

Buffoo, evolution doesn't stop because you don't believe in it.

Nor does it happen simply because you believe in it. 

No, there has to be scientific evidence.  Either evolution happens, is a fact, or some higher power is making the entire world behave as if it  were a fact, providing insurmountable evidence that evolution happens.

But as I've observed before, it's fine with *ME* if you don't believe in evolution. 
 

*SOMEBODY* has to be the prey...

Which brings us right back around to the crux of the argument.  Fact: The Theory of Evolution does not have insurmountable evidence that proves it.  So it should never be taught as a fact.  Another observation I have made is that people whose credo is "survival of the fittest" are usually the type of person that would be the first to go.  Don't worry Random it is not true and even if it were their isn't enough meat on you to justify the effort.  We would have to throw you back;D 

Fact:  Yes, it does.  Evolution is as firmly established as gravity.  You just don't like its implications, because you look at others and see a reflection of your own motivations.  That's why Republicans generally don't trust Democrats and Democrats all-too-often trust Republicans too much.

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There's less meat on me than on you, true, but mine's getting leaner as we speak. 

 One more question Wayfarer. Who is this guy? Is he eligible for heaven? 

And if he was not close enough to human for you, what about Neanderthal. He was not our species, but he sure did look a lot like us.

 Don't know what he is.  God knows and that's good enough for me.

That's a cop out Wayfarer.

But even though you bring up evolution, I believe you think this a meaningless debate when you have no answer,  so I'll exit. :)

Baseline analysis:  Intelligent Design Creationism ("creationism in a cheap tuxedo") is that which is being pushed by this movie.  It's bad science and even worse theology.  The best that can be said about it is what one physicist said about "string theory" in theoretical physics:  It's not even *WRONG*.