Young, Professional and often Sarcastic
Teaching, politics and that nagging suspicion that everyone in your field is a pedophile.
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bghayes - > Young, Professional and often Sarcastic -> Vegas, Mettler and Why People Leave This Town
Vegas, Mettler and Why People Leave This Town

Drinking a Pepsi and throwing down my regular healthy breakfast of sausage biscuit, I'm skimming headlines.

"Kern High School District trustee Ken Mettler is proposing requirements for all classes to say the Pledge of Allegience. "

I almost threw something against the wall.

It is a ridiculous crime to dominate the education of our children, the school board that decides how to assist them and the town with this frivilous superfluous bull.  What in the world is going on in this town that this is an acceptable use of the school board's time?

Nevermind the state testing scores we have, the levels of increasing poverty on the East Side or South.  Nevermind the lack of materials or funding.

Believe in God and say the Pledge, everything will be swell. If you aren't doing those things, well gee whiz we better spend time and money making sure you do.

Grrrr. I've been debating for several years as that I'm still in my mid-twenties whether to build my family here or move somewhere that has vision, art and direction. Do I stay and fight to improve the town or give my talents to somewhere already headed in the right direction?

That debate still rages on but it's inching pretty darn close to my saying adieu in two years. These people exhaust me.

 

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posted by bghayes on Thursday, October 11, 2007 at 09:00 AM
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34 comments from 11 users

1

posted by mattloch on Oct 11, 2007 at 09:42 AM
Well didn't you notice? Everything started getting worse in our schools as soon as (insert issue here)

* students stopped saying the Pledge of Allegiance
* students stopped praying to God
* students started learning about evolution
* students were taught sex-ed
* etc
* etc
* etc
posted by commonsense on Oct 11, 2007 at 10:51 AM

blah blah blah why dont you move to the desert .

posted by sagefever on Oct 11, 2007 at 11:09 AM
He lives in the desert now....
posted by blognroll on Oct 11, 2007 at 11:16 AM
I was thinking about leaving this town, and then, this came along, so I've decided to stick around.  Too bad for liberals who were about ready to break out the champagne.
posted by bghayes on Oct 11, 2007 at 11:36 AM

Coastal regions, which have higher costs of living, tend to attract the wealthy which are more often than not the intellects and savvy. Coastal regions in most cases are more liberal. Hence the West Coast in general being liberal and the middle American land locked conservatism, mirrored with New York and the East Coast.  Therefore, going to a desert would be going to a conservative stronghold and going to the coast would most likely mean going towards liberal.

 

I'll take the coast.

posted by blognroll on Oct 11, 2007 at 11:51 AM
I like the climate on the coast and think the heat here sucks, but, as the Bible says about folks heading to the coast because they think they're smarter than the rest of us, "Professing to be wise, they became fools."  Some move to the coast because of the better climate, others, because they can't take the "heat."  And by "heat," I mean mid-western common sense. 
posted by robbwillis on Oct 11, 2007 at 12:39 PM
When the Pledge becomes mandatory, will there be adult monitors to catch the more savy students lip-synching or will snitches be employed to enforce compliance?
posted by randomfactor on Oct 11, 2007 at 12:41 PM

If I were still of school age, I would resurrect the Nixon-era version of the pledge, which ends:

 

"...with liberty and justice for al-most everyone."

.

(Of course--those Godless Heathens the Jehovah's Witnesses will have to be punished for non-compliance, Robb.

posted by randomfactor on Oct 11, 2007 at 12:42 PM
By "heat," I mean high temperature, BLT.    But perhaps you subscribe to the Humpty Dumpty's view of words.  There's glory for you.
posted by mattloch on Oct 11, 2007 at 12:44 PM
Don't forget those atheistic Quakers too, Random.
posted by blognroll on Oct 11, 2007 at 01:07 PM

When the Pledge becomes mandatory, will there be adult monitors to catch the more savy students lip-synching or will snitches be employed to enforce compliance?

Hold the switches, I'm a compassionate conservative.   But I would like to be among the first to volunteer to be such a monitor. My resume is rather light for the job, but I have watched plenty of Ashlee Simpson and Britney Spears music videos. 

posted by mattloch on Oct 11, 2007 at 01:10 PM
I guess we could always let the students become self-policing.....

posted by TomW on Oct 11, 2007 at 01:32 PM
Let's be clear about the "Midwest".  Basically, if you live near a shipping lane, you're more likely to be liberal based on population density.  Look at the election maps by county and you and see the Mississippi.
posted by dgrealish on Oct 11, 2007 at 01:54 PM
Am I the oldest person looking on here?  It was never mandatory that every student "say" the pledge of allegiance.  The Witnesses stood with their hands at their sides and said nothing.  And, by freshman year, more than a few students were mumbling or shooting rubber bands at one another during the Pledge.  But, as I said in Dr. Bruce's blog on the same subject,  we knew all the words to the Pledge of Allegiance, and were not only taught the National Anthem but were also taught it's history.  Knowing this gave us a sense of pride when we said the Pledge and sang the Star Spangled Banner.  What the heck is wrong with having pride in ones country.  Or maybe the problem is with being compelled to recite the Pledge of Allegiance.  We were also in school, compelled to learn poetry, literature, our times table, the periodic table, many things which no one seems to pitch a fit about.  Only if it comes to love of God or America, do people become upset.  I want my children and grandchildren to be proud of their country.  I want them to know that the last line of the Star Spangled Banner is not "Gentlemen Start Your Engines".  And school is the place to be taught this.  Right along with American History, because this is American History.
posted by mattloch on Oct 11, 2007 at 02:00 PM
dgrealish: "Or maybe the problem is with being compelled to recite the Pledge of Allegiance.  We were also in school, compelled to learn poetry, literature, our times table, the periodic table, many things which no one seems to pitch a fit about. Only if it comes to love of God or America in school, do people become upset. "

Fixed that for you.

(Of course, if people were compelling you to love "Allah" or "Buddah" in school, you might start to see the problem then.)
posted by RosemarysAbortionist on Oct 11, 2007 at 02:01 PM
Name one person who is upset by love of America.  Some people get upset, however, when one implies that to love America, one must also love God.  To the amazement of some, the words God and America are not equivalent.
posted by bghayes on Oct 11, 2007 at 02:08 PM

Honestly, I focus on patriotism in the sense of pride in this country and our accomplishments. Forced routines, brainwashing techniques and religion are not the tools I find useful in winning someone's respect. I teach my students to respect our country, our differences and the opportunities they have here that are unavailable anywhere else.

There is pride and love in being able to be different and still considered a part of the whole. That's American.

posted by dgrealish on Oct 11, 2007 at 02:12 PM
Ah, Mattloch, you fixed it for yourself.  I doubt you will find many people my age who felt they were hurt by the Pledge of Allegiance and believe it was a harmful thing to learn in school.  The reason the Witnesses don't recite it is because they feel it conflicts with their religious beliefs.  We are after all free to pursue the religion of our choice.  My choice is Christianity.  And to the other poster, I never implied anything of the sort.  Try reading it slowly.  The statement separated God and America with the word "or".
posted by sagefever on Oct 11, 2007 at 02:19 PM
Actually dgrealish it was mandatory to say the pledge:In 1940 the Witnesses took the case to SCOTUS and won ,one of several cases , to have the right not to say the pledge.
posted by dgrealish on Oct 11, 2007 at 02:21 PM

Well, I guess I'm not the oldest person in here afterall.  I was talking from my experience.  I thought that was obvious.

I apologize, that sounds so awful.  Of course you're right and thank you for correcting me. 

posted by randomfactor on Oct 11, 2007 at 02:22 PM
My choice is not to have a religion, as I don't need one.  If an outside group pays for "In God We Trust" posters in the schools and is permitted to hang them, I will bring an equivalent atheistic quotations to put alongside them.  Both my kids are beyond school age, but I'd be willing to go to the expense to encourage the ten-percent or so of students who will eventually grow up not to need a religion either.
posted by GotREALITY on Oct 11, 2007 at 02:25 PM
RF, you should propose that to Vegas.
posted by robbwillis on Oct 11, 2007 at 02:25 PM

Everyday rote memorization and recitation works swell for math in the 3rd grade. Use the same method for the Pledge and there's a definite burnout factor in highschool or before. Listening to or singing the Anthem once and a while can be a stirring, patriotic experience. When it's trotted out before every ballgame, it becomes elevator music. I don't expect this simple observation to have much effect on rabid Pledge and Anthem zealots, but as Groucho Marx didn't say to the mother of 10,

"I love my cigar, too, but I take it out of my mouth once in a while."  

posted by mattloch on Oct 11, 2007 at 02:31 PM
Actually dg, I fixed it for those who don't believe in your position; those who may be cowed into allowing your beliefs to be foisted (some would say forced, or at least mandated) upon them in school, those who do believe in your God but don't believe it is the school's job to teach about Him, and those who believe that the separation between church and state is real.

I understand that this one thing alone may not be all that harmful. The problem is that some people and groups see this as a "chink" in the Constitutionally-mandated wall between church and state. Those people want to use this smaller issue as a wedge in order to transplant more overt (and harmful) beliefs into the schools. If this were viewed in a vacuum, I may agree with you. But it isn't. This is part of a larger picture. And one which doesn't have a happy ending for many people.
posted by sagefever on Oct 11, 2007 at 02:37 PM
NP dgrelish~ I would not have known myself except for an excellent doc I saw on PBS "knocking" ,I did a blog about it  aways back..and even then I had to do a search for the dates etc. , because I am not that old...ahem..
posted by dgrealish on Oct 11, 2007 at 02:38 PM
You're right Rob, but I think the point is, it's being neglected in the schools.  Teachers have taken it upon themselves to  completely do away with it.  I can remember more than once in high school, saying the Pledge because the second period teacher got a memo saying  "it had come to the Administrations attention it was not being done".  The teacher had no problem letting us know this was the only reason we were saying it.  (I went to high school in the Viet Nam era.)  We always run the risk of the teacher's personal beliefs bleeding over into the classroom.  It's fine when they parallel our own.  But when they're conflicting, we have a problem.  Is it really too big a deal to recite those 30 words a couple of times a week?  Is the teacher really that overworked?  Or is it something else that makes the teacher decide to take it out of the curriculum? 
posted by sagefever on Oct 11, 2007 at 02:51 PM
I went in the same era dg~BHS~ and we did it over the audio system between class. got to the point some kids kept walking,some stopped and listen,few did the heart on the hand..did it make any of them less patriotic? Most went on to fight and/or die in the war,so whose to say?Patriotism is not something that can be mandated or taught~it must be inspired and nutured in the human heart..a poster or a daily pledge just is not going to do it.
posted by robbwillis on Oct 11, 2007 at 02:59 PM
I think that's a good compromise, dgrealish. I'm from the same era as you and at my schools, it was the Pledge every ding dong day all the way through highschool. I can't say whether it made me more patriotic, but it definitely turned me off reciting any kind of pledge. Those with more tolerance for such things should consider those with less tolerance.  
posted by blognroll on Oct 11, 2007 at 03:20 PM

My choice is not to have a religion, as I don't need one.  If an outside group pays for "In God We Trust" posters in the schools and is permitted to hang them, I will bring an equivalent atheistic quotations to put alongside them.  Both my kids are beyond school age, but I'd be willing to go to the expense to encourage the ten-percent or so of students who will eventually grow up not to need a religion either.

I heard you've been passing out notes with the phrase IN GOD WE TRUST all of your adult life.  Everytime you pay for something that costs a dollar or more, you are participating in the very process you so vehemently protest.  So what you're saying doesn't make much cents (or dollars for that matter). 

posted by randomfactor on Oct 11, 2007 at 03:47 PM

It's on the coins, too, BLT.   But then again, so is E. Coli--which is much more significant than the raised lettering professing something I don't believe in. 

For that matter, as I mentioned elsewhere, it says "One Dollar," too, but that's not true either.

.

And a greater and greater percentage of our kids will grow up not to need religion.  More and more young people (under 30) are already saying they have problems with organized Christianity, for example.  Folks like ol' Chad and Pope Ratzi deserve a great deal of credit on that score.  Isn't that a wonderful thing?  Just as hardly anyone sacrifices to the rain gods today.   (I do miss them old sky-clad services, though...)

posted by blognroll on Oct 11, 2007 at 04:18 PM
Well, if you want to know my opinion on organized religion, its spirituality that means the most to me.  Religion sets the stage for spirituality, but it cannot make it happen.  And organizing a religion has its advantages, but the problem lies in the tendency of individuals to begin worshipping the structure of the religion and not the God of the religion.  Then the structure creates an implosion that results in young people being turned off. 
posted by randomfactor on Oct 11, 2007 at 04:21 PM

Folks like Chad, Ted Haggard, Gary Aldredge and such have more to do with it than the structure, I think. 

.

For example, their railing against same-sex marriage when more and more young adults *KNOW* gays personally.  When doctrine contradicts your own lyin' eyes, who are you gonna believe?

posted by blognroll on Oct 11, 2007 at 04:32 PM

I try to follow Christ, not any person.  People will always disappoint you. 

posted by randomfactor on Oct 11, 2007 at 04:35 PM

Christ was a people, too.

.

Far too many Christians one meets today are of the sort Gandhi disapproved of.

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