Depends on who you ask. Far as I know, a recession is a recession after two successive quarters of negative growth. That distinction is meaningless to an unemployed laid-off worker about to lose his home or single mom who can't afford gas to get to her minimum wage job or senior who can't afford medication.

Now, if someone's Aunt Zelda croaks and leaves a windfall and the beneficery buys a foreclosed home at bargin, let the good times roll.

Weighing the pros and cons, yeah, we're in a depression.

 Not yet,  2Q 2009....Can`t avoid it ,only a recession now.

 not yet, but we could if the gov. doesnt step up and help resolve some of the economic issues.

THIS is the "great" depression.

And remember, until WWII the little mixup from 1914-1918 was "The Great War."

 Compare the way people were dressed in this breadline compared to the one in the above link.  I'm appalled that anyone would compare the two.

Credit for photos goes to ABOUT.COm 20th Century History.  http://history1900s.about.c...

 When I read in yesterday's paper that there are more people on food stamps today than any time since 1960, my heart sank.  At that moment I literally,  viscerally, felt the depression.  My heart goes out to the poorest Americans.  They'll be the ones who suffer the most.

Cheney thinks that Bush's legacy won't be understood for 30 years.  Tell that to the people signing up for food stamps.

 The new depression today. Photo credit to New York Times.

I agree with Nancy here.  Things aren't great, but it's no great depression. 

 Yet.

I could have posted this on the blog last week about trite sayings, but it seems more appropriate here.

'If it were'nt for bad news there'd be no news at all.'

The people in the Depression era photo would qualify as homeless today.  Today, they would be bullied off the streets by city and county authorities and expected to somehow disappear, out of sight and mind. And, they would be blamed for their own financial situations by self-hating right-wingers whose own situations aren't much better.

 When I think of the stories my Mother told of my Dad walking all day to try to find a few pennies work to feed his children, the pictures of a guy sitting on the sidewalk in New York with a sign looking for a miracle it makes my teeth grind.  I have this mental picture (from the actual words) that my Dad would sit on the step and not go inside so that my Mother would feed the kids...how he would hang his head and cry because he couldn't provide for them.  My blood pressure goes through the roof.

I'm not saying there aren't hard times for a lot of people right now.  But to compare our economy to the Great Depression is absolutely ludicrous.   There are churches, programs, gleaners, food stamps..all providing food for people in need.  And even to some who aren't in need but are using the system.  There are shelters for homeless to get a bed or a meal.  There are programs to retrain people at no cost.

I don't know what kind of miracle the guy in the picture from NY needs but he's clean and in decent looking clothes and you can bet he knows where to get his next meal.    People in the REAL depression didn't even know if there would BE a next meal..for them OR for their children.

Playing on the words of a real economic tragedy for political gain is nauseating.  Ya know..I rarely really get angry on here but this one really got my dander up.

Not yet ,I agree with Nancy and Tom. But like the man in Adam's picture a miracle would not hurt.

 A newspaper sensationalizing a tired topic in an attempt to sell more papers? NAWWWWWW.....

 The folks in the photo from The Independent look like the people I used to always see at the airport getting on commercial flights. Just because Americans have no fashion sense any longer doesn't mean they aren't just as broke as their more conservative dressed brethren seventy years ago. There has been a wealth of data pointing to the real similarities between today's economic reality and the Great Depression. Here is summary from the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities website that details the growing disparity between the very top and the majority of Americans.

 Thirty years ago I worked in an office facing 24th street.  Reagan was in office and the term "street people" had just been coined.  I used to see homeless people walking down 24th street on their way to Hwy 99.  They were so pitiful I'd  comment on how sad they looked.

The general consensus in the office was that they "WANTED TO BE HOMELESS".      "THEY LIKED IT"

That attitude certainly took away any responsibility my coworkers may have felt towards helping them or even empathizing with them.

Being the youngest person on the staff, I learned to keep my mouth closed.

 Fear mongering, scare tactics, sensationalizing, trading on real misery for an agenda, no matter what it is, makes my blood boil.

I'm going to find the humor blog I just passed over. 

 Nancy

What agenda?  I'm confused. 

 Is this fear mongering, scare tactics, it should make your blood boil. It is a reality and this is just the start, not even a depression yet, give it 3 more quarters 2nd Q 2009, Denial or humor will not make it go away

 BoomTent cities spring up in LA

http://uk.youtube.com/watch...

 Audrey..my comment popped up after yours and made it look like I was responding to yours.   I was actually addressing OldBlues comment about sensationalism to sell papers.

The henny penny approach to an agenda always irks me but the real misery this country faced during the depression is a tragedy and I resent newspapers using that phrase to bolster their cause..whatever it is.

I agree with you about what you said "'If it were'nt for bad news there'd be no news at all.'  Sad huh?

This business of us posting a thought and having it pop up in the middle of something someone else said can get tricky.  LOL.  Too bad we can't move it around to where it was supposed to go.

 We currently arent in a situation like the Great Depression so far. During the GD unemployement was 25%, we currently on the national level only have around 6%. But we are seeing people lose their homes, 401K, IRAs, Jobs etc, etc etc. I do think we are in for a very very tough time ahead for middle class America. I think we are going to see a massive recession that we all feel the pain. Look at the price of gas, food, clothing, utilities.

SPAM Code: CCC SF (code meaning?)

 Maggie..there's no denial here and the comment about humor was meant for a cool down period.  I can see you don't have the ability to move from one blood temp to another.

Fact is, tent cities have been in Fresno for ages..and have been torn down only to reappear.  (big article in thier paper about it a while back.  They've hardly just "sprung up."  My granddaughter tells me they were in Las Vegas too.  I don't think it's a rarity or anything new.  As Audrey pointed out, 30 years ago she was aware of the homeless.

I don't have any skeletons in my closet so I'll share a bit of family history with you folks.  My grandfather abandoned his family and then down the road "rode" the rails from TX to Bakersfield.  I don't know if this was a gesture to be close to his family or a way to get something from them but in any case, he was an alcoholic panhandler down on "skid row" on 19th Street in Bakersfield.  He was what we would now call "homeless."  Mind you, this was by choice because he couldn't live the way he did and stay with the family.

His "homeless" stint ended when he fell off the bench in a paddy wagon and broke his leg.  He used to say that he was in Kern General Hopsital when the big quake hit in 1952 and when it knocked him out of bed, he "saw the light" and never drank again.  He also used to say to our dog "Skipper, let's get us a dimes worth of weiners and go live under the bridge."   He knew what he was talking about.

I guess the point to this meandering discourse is that not all homeless people are suffering from misfortune other than what they make themselves, and that "tent cities" and homeless people aren't anything new or caused by an administration.

 Well, if we're not in a depression, how come the economy makes me feel depressed?

 Sf..recession, maybe.  Great depression, no.  If you want to compare economics in general that's ok but this business of  people losing homes is not caused by the economy..it's caused for the most part by greed on the part of the housing/lending industry and pure ignorance along with greed by the people who were out to make a quick buck any way they could...either by buying or selling.

 Catpaw..sometimes it's just the blogs that depress me.  LOL.

 The rarity is that they are whole foreclosed families, not down and out hobos.

" Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt"

Abraham Lincoln

 Nancy I didn't say we were in a Depression yet or even near one. I do believe as I said before we are in a great recession.

 How clever of you Maggie..and so original.

USA 2008: The Great Depression

Food stamps are the symbol of poverty in the US. In the era of the credit crunch, a record 28 million Americans are now relying on them to survive – a sure sign the world's richest country faces economic crisis

We knew things were bad on Wall Street, but on Main Street it may be worse. Startling official statistics show that as a new economic recession stalks the United States, a record number of Americans will shortly be depending on food stamps just to feed themselves and their families.

Dismal projections by the Congressional Budget Office in Washington suggest that in the fiscal year starting in October, 28 million people in the US will be using government food stamps to buy essential groceries, the highest level since the food assistance programme was introduced in the 1960s.

And the next monthly job numbers, to be released this Friday, are likely to show 50,000 more jobs were lost nationwide in March, and the unemployment rate is up to perhaps 5 per cent.

http://www.independent.co.u...

 Here is a link to the Great Depression: http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

Here is a link to recession: http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

Here is stagflation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

Here is a link to inflation: http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

Thought these might help as we discuss what is happening to our economy.

One of the reasons that people are losing their homes is because they bought houses using subprime lenders and variable interest rates under the pie-in-the-sky impression that everyone is entitled to own their own home. I could buy a small house if I wanted to, but I don't want to; a 49-year-old bachelor doesn't really need a house (unless he's trying attract some recently-divorced gal with a whole passel of kids, which I'm not) all to himself. Entire families shouldn't try to live in their own house unless both parents have the ability to earn at least $100,000/year combined. Pride and the entitlement mindset get people into trouble; then they blame someone else for their own irresponsible actions.

Approximately 85% of homeless people are practicing alcoholics or addicts, or they are mentally ill. Most of those you see with "Will work for food" signs won't; they only want a handout. During the depression, people wanted work but couldn't find it; these days there is work - Sears actually hires people that apply and can pass a drug test and criminal background check - but with this "entitlement" epidemic that has been around for the last several decades, people expect to find a job with good pay and benefits. Take what you can get, hopefully you can do better later is what my dad always said, and that's just what I did at the job I'm at now.

 and what about those who rented homes and are now force out due to their rental home was foreclosed on. Again, we are blaming our fellow Americans, so did make mistakes, but not all and not the majority. I remeber the early 80s when we saw family living out of cars and hotels due to losing their homes. The interest on a home mort during that time was up to 12% in some cases.

 Good one SFBos, helps alot if folks are up on what they think they are talking about,

"Real knowledge is to know the extent of one's ignorance"   Confucius

 When people buy a house they can't afford, they choose to be homeless. While house shopping over the last few months, I started to notice the cars parked in the driveways of these foreclosed homes. Usually 2-3 cars, sometimes brand new or close to it. Expensive furniture and electronic equipment. They are not hurt by the "market", but by their own greed and envy. Are they truly homeless now? No, they are renters. With nice stuff.

I have talked with many homeless people and if you talk to them long enough you find out they are not victims of anything but their own inability to take responsibility.

 Sears requires a address and mailing address. I don`t think " 3rd blue tent to the left of the cardboard structure down by the cottonwoods" will suffice

 I know some people who are barely getting by. Now when they bought they were living on 2 salaries, since one was laid off for a month, then accepted a job that paid less, they are having a hard time meeting thier mort payment. They are like alot of people and I for one do not believe people who bought homes they could barely afford, choose to be homeless, I have far more compassion for my fellow man.

 But, they choose to be uninformed and greedy and unaware of the realities of having reserves or living within a long term plan budget. Agree?

 I know my fellow man makes bad decisions (including myself). I am currently buying a home that is small and not in the best area because it is what I can afford. I put an extra mortgage payment in the bank in case something happens.

Expecting someone to pay for and learn from their mistakes is the utmost of compassion.

I suggest lithium.

Sears requires a address and mailing address. I don`t think " 3rd blue tent to the left of the cardboard structure down by the cottonwoods" will suffice.

There are dozens of organizations that will allow you have your mail sent to their address: St. Vincent de Paul centers let homeless people get their mail there, as do Catholic Charities. They'll also take phone messages. People who move from one place to another on a regular basis will often choose to have their mail sent to an organization's address; I did in 1994. People who live tin the 3rd blue tent do so because they want to live that way. There are homeless shelters for people who want to live there, but you can't drink - period - or get high, and you can't light up a cigarette every fifteen minutes like some people find it necessary to do. You have to live by their rules, and that's where the problem lies: people who are entitled to absolutely nothing who think they are entitled to everything.

 Warning" not for the faint at heart"    read all and give a educated opinion

 The Timing Indicates That We Are Still in the Early Stages of the Bursting of the Great Mortgage Bubble

 When we were in the '70s, 20% of the people controlled 80% of the money. I recently heard that now it is about 1/2% control 90% of the money. So the rich are doing fine, Exxon, Chevron, Haliburton and all oil related business is booming.

It is just the 99.5% of us that are in a depression. Exxon is doing just fine thank you, as is British Petroleum (BP).

 What's really sad are the people who accuse others who have been in that situation, or deal with them all the time, of not knowing what they are talking about.

John admits he knows, and motopoet has posted several times about the people who live in, or around the Mission that he has spoken to or dealth with over the years he worked in that area.  I dealt with them in my job too.

The difference is that some of us expect them to work, or pull themselves up and since cliches have been tossed around here's another one for you.  They need "a hand UP, not out."  I don't see anyone addressing my comments about free housing, free food, free employment training or any of the other things people can do to help themselves.

As for renters getting shafted due to  the housing disaster yes, that does happen. But those are not the majority of the people losing their homes.

 By the way.  I'm still waiting for someone to "bail me out."  I want a home in a nice neighborhood that I can pay a fraction for.  I want someone to provide me with food and clothing.  I want the freedom of not working for everything I have.  In the 20 someodd years I've been single not one single person has given me anything.  Nothing.  Nada.  I've worked for every dime I have and yet some of you would have me share that dime with somone unwilling to help themselves.  Yup...that's those damned conservatives for you..no compassion at all.  Silly us, thinking we ALL need to pull out weight.

Dang..sorry I got off topic.  We were talking about the recession,coming depression weren't we?  Again..the total fault of the right.

 These are families with kids, not a individual, you have to get a grasp on that, families with kids, families with kids, Have you ever been to a shelter? are you familar with the rules? Does the family pick up all thier possessions and walk to the local park and  wait for the dad to walk to work and come back and stand in line to get in for the night again, you leave during the day, it`s a shelter for the night, you do not move in, you do not get the same bed every night, you will not have the whole family together or a "room", females /males seperated...visit one or better yet volunteer, try helping with Christmas dinner one year if you want to get the true feeling of "helping your fellow man", you will always be better for it, it`s a family ritual for us every year

 I wasnt accusing anyone. I too have worked w/ the underclass and those who made poor decisions or had bad breaks in life. I believe there should be a mix of support for all people.  I worked as a social worker for 9 years, when I started out I was a true conservative and during the 9 years changed to be a socialist.

Now...there are people who are working and still are not making it or living the American dream. There are those who live way beyond their budget. But no matter what, there should be help for people, rather it teaching them how to manage their money and how to buget to providing services to help them keep their jobs, homes, health care.

As the death toll in Iraq would be much higher without modern medicine, the impact of the current recession (and possibly nascent depression) would be much worse without the safety net installed in the Great Depression.

.

Which is why Republicans are working night and day to cut that safety net to ribbons.  

 Random, I usually agree with you but  " what?"  are you on the right thread?. Even though this is a political landmine for a disscussion let`s stick to the original post, Try opening a new topic " is the upcoming big depression a GOP or DEM instituted problem ?" I`d be there in a flash !! lol

My point was that the safety net instituted by Democrats after/during the Great Depression is softening the effect of this one.   Making it more difficult to compare the two.

.

One thing is, it's certainly too early in the process to tell which way we're going and how far.